Incorrect rescue responses

[Alan (Big Al)]

If you notice on the pager sites that whenever there is an MVA, Car v Pedestrian etc etc there is a page sent to the ambulance and one to cap code 1924962

For example:

1924962 15:33:32 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala
1924690 15:33:30 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala

 
1924962 14:36:47 06-09-07 RI400 Cat2 20 Belvidere Rd, Saddleworth
1924334 14:35:28 06-09-07 RI81 Cat 2 - V/A


1924962 08:59:18 06-09-07 SA81 Cat2 Grand Junction Rd, Hope Valley 96 G6
1908871 09:00:53 06-09-07 MFS: INC # 13 - 06/09/07 09:02,RESPOND RCR,GRAND JUNCTION RD,HOPE VALLEY, MAP 96 G 6 ,,BETWEEN RESERVOIR AND AROONGA POSSIBLE PERSONS TRAPPED,9419 301 329*CFSRES:


 

[mack]

mmm i see what you mean.... seems strange.

[Pipster]

As for that pager id No. it always comes up for MVA's etc but also for similar things on private land (person off motorbike etc).
But it still could have been anything.

sorry still not quite sure what you mean... this number 1924962 is the pager capcode.
doesnt have anythign to do with what the message is, it is purely the adress the message has been sent to. whether this is a group that all higher category responses go to or what i dont know... but i cant see how it tells anyone what kind of job it is...

I think you might find that that particular capcode is attached to a pager  or pager Group, informing the relevant people of a (potentially) serious trauma...  sometimes that pager number will come up with another ambulance stations code in, without a  page to that station - that would be because the ambulance crew did not get a pager message for it, as they were already on air.......but it went to the trauma page / group page, or whatever it might be.

It would appear then, that this pager we are talking about, tends to indicate a crash of somesort...(it doesn't seem to be sent when the trauma is something like a broken arm on the footy field..)

Can someone from SAAS perhaps clarify this us...?

Pip

[SA Firey]

That capcode belongs to SAAS Supervisors pager...SOT

[RescueHazmat]

If you notice on the pager sites that whenever there is an MVA, Car v Pedestrian etc etc there is a page sent to the ambulance and one to cap code 1924962

For example:

1924962 15:33:32 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala
1924690 15:33:30 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala

 
1924962 14:36:47 06-09-07 RI400 Cat2 20 Belvidere Rd, Saddleworth
1924334 14:35:28 06-09-07 RI81 Cat 2 - V/A


1924962 08:59:18 06-09-07 SA81 Cat2 Grand Junction Rd, Hope Valley 96 G6
1908871 09:00:53 06-09-07 MFS: INC # 13 - 06/09/07 09:02,RESPOND RCR,GRAND JUNCTION RD,HOPE VALLEY, MAP 96 G 6 ,,BETWEEN RESERVOIR AND AROONGA POSSIBLE PERSONS TRAPPED,9419 301 329*CFSRES:


 

I would assume an RTL or Paramedic / ICP rostered to that area in the chance they are near by / available.

[Alan (Big Al)]

1924962 19:15:02 04-09-07 GO181 Cat2 Winery Rd, Currency Creek POLICE REQUIRED

1924962 19:17:12 04-09-07 HM2 Cat2 Winery Rd, Currency Creek POLICE REQUIRED

1924962 19:31:25 04-09-07 V126 Cat2 Winery Rd, Currency Creek POLICE REQUIRED

1908073 19:48:06 04-09-07 MFS: INC # 69 - 04/09/07 19:49,RESPOND LIGHTING,CURRENCY CREEK ,CURRENCY CREEK, MAP 0 0 0 ,,PROVIDE LIGHTING FOR CASUALTY RETRIEVAL. WINERY RD HALF KM FROM MAIN RD. P2,73229*CFSRES:

1908892 20:25:42 04-09-07 MFS: INC # 71 - 04/09/07 20:26,RESPOND Assist SAAS,STRATHALBYN-GOOLWA RD,CURRENCY CREEK, MAP 301 D 2 ,,CORNER WINERY RD, ASSIST SES WITH TRAFFIC CONTROL FOR HELICOPTER RETRIEVAL,18324*CFSRES:

I guess closest resource doesn't count for much.

 




 

Excert from local rag:

A 27yr old currency creek man suffered serious injuries after rolling his car on winery road at currency creek at approximatly 7:30pm on tuesday night, he was airlifted to flinders medical centre.

I believe that our GO is taking this to region but am not totally sure.

[SA Firey]

If you notice on the pager sites that whenever there is an MVA, Car v Pedestrian etc etc there is a page sent to the ambulance and one to cap code 1924962

For example:

1924962 15:33:32 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala
1924690 15:33:30 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala

 
1924962 14:36:47 06-09-07 RI400 Cat2 20 Belvidere Rd, Saddleworth
1924334 14:35:28 06-09-07 RI81 Cat 2 - V/A


1924962 08:59:18 06-09-07 SA81 Cat2 Grand Junction Rd, Hope Valley 96 G6
1908871 09:00:53 06-09-07 MFS: INC # 13 - 06/09/07 09:02,RESPOND RCR,GRAND JUNCTION RD,HOPE VALLEY, MAP 96 G 6 ,,BETWEEN RESERVOIR AND AROONGA POSSIBLE PERSONS TRAPPED,9419 301 329*CFSRES:


 

I would assume an RTL or Paramedic / ICP rostered to that area in the chance they are near by / available.

Negative is SOT

1924962 20:57:22 06-09-07 PP181 Cat2 Cnr Three Chain Rd, Port Pirie C228 N6 SAAS Supervisor?

[RescueHazmat]

Just cause some random has put that after a pager message on their pager site, doesn't make it fact.

Also, notice the question mark.. That would suggest they are guessing.

[pumprescue]

1924962 19:15:02 04-09-07 GO181 Cat2 Winery Rd, Currency Creek POLICE REQUIRED

1924962 19:17:12 04-09-07 HM2 Cat2 Winery Rd, Currency Creek POLICE REQUIRED

1924962 19:31:25 04-09-07 V126 Cat2 Winery Rd, Currency Creek POLICE REQUIRED

1908073 19:48:06 04-09-07 MFS: INC # 69 - 04/09/07 19:49,RESPOND LIGHTING,CURRENCY CREEK ,CURRENCY CREEK, MAP 0 0 0 ,,PROVIDE LIGHTING FOR CASUALTY RETRIEVAL. WINERY RD HALF KM FROM MAIN RD. P2,73229*CFSRES:

1908892 20:25:42 04-09-07 MFS: INC # 71 - 04/09/07 20:26,RESPOND Assist SAAS,STRATHALBYN-GOOLWA RD,CURRENCY CREEK, MAP 301 D 2 ,,CORNER WINERY RD, ASSIST SES WITH TRAFFIC CONTROL FOR HELICOPTER RETRIEVAL,18324*CFSRES:

I guess closest resource doesn't count for much.

 




 

Excert from local rag:

A 27yr old currency creek man suffered serious injuries after rolling his car on winery road at currency creek at approximatly 7:30pm on tuesday night, he was airlifted to flinders medical centre.

I believe that our GO is taking this to region but am not totally sure.

Hmmm, thats poor form from SAAS, unless the person was thrown from the car, but still, poor form.

[chook]

I guess its because the protocols aren't fully understood or policed by all. And there a faults on all sides - have plenty of incidents where fire (non rescue) SAAS & SAPOL have gone to jobs yet we were not called. When asked why, "The response was didn't think you guys were needed". However everytime we roll to an MVA I ensure fire is called.
Had a recent out of town job near a hamlet called Lyrup - day time page said cleanup only. For us it a 15 - 20 minute drive (if you don't take the ferry). Got there no fire cover, called up Adelaide fire who responded the next closest CFS brigade (which was not the closest resource), still no response called again & finally Berri MFS arrived. I explained to the crew what we had done to make the vehicle safe & why I insisted on fire cover (protocol). They were happy & they agreed to take over the scene - (Explained that I had a meeting at nine & after all they get paid ). We have an understanding that we take turns on who stays and who stands down (Helps with inter service relationships too). Another job Bdouble on its side responded straight to the scene. There were two female ambos dragging this rather large truckie out through the windscreen (broken obviously).Asked if there were any others, the response was "we only called you guys cause we thought there was a car under it" - there wasn't thankfully. Fuel everywhere no fire cover, however it was called and arrived.

Until these protocols are taught to, reinforced & policed by ALL emergency responders then this will continue to occur. As was told to me by someone who trains SAAS people - the new ones can be a little bit "Rescue Dumb" this is not having a shot at anyone but if your not aware of the resources in the area how do you know who does what?
It was interesting the comment made about SES's relationship with the ambo's down there, as we have the opposite issue with new paramedics up here i.e. fire does everthing! Anyway as long as everyone plays by the rules, the situation should improve. cheers

[6739264]

The problem arises with so many different resources being needed. It should be a simple process of responding, Police, Ambulance and Fire.

I applaud the SES for their volunteer work, but honestly, it would be so much easier if it were just Police, Fire, Ambulance. It covers all bases and means you fire cover and rescue are one and the same.

[chook]

I totally agree - in theory, but history has proven that it doesn't work in practice. Even in the states with the Super fire and rescue services, SES still exists, still does rescue (including RCR) and if having fire services do everything why form the State Emergency Service in the first place? And remember when you guys are tied up with your Lead combatant authority stuff (fire including wild fire) we are still around to do the rescue stuff.
A simpler solution is the Victorian way SES does rescue (except for a very few CFA brigades & their Mets - word is no more CFA rescue brigades will be formed). Personally I would like to see combined units in rural areas, SAFECOM units with a fire team trained by CFS with a fire officer & a rescue team trained by SES with a rescue officer. Any town that has a higher population e.g Mt Gambier, Pt Pirie e.t.c would have the above with a payed crew on day shift.
This is what the review should be looking at, controversial I know & the associations would hate it but that is the future how I see it. Cheers

[backburn]

Had a recent out of town job near a hamlet called Lyrup - day time page said cleanup only. For us it a 15 - 20 minute drive (if you don't take the ferry). Got there no fire cover, called up Adelaide fire who responded the next closest CFS brigade (which was not the closest resource),

Why was Lyrup not the closest resource? Who do you think should have responded?  Sounds like you came from Berri or Renmark. There pagers did not go off so how could they have responded. Well thats what I was told.

[rescue5271]

May be next time you need to say page XYZ brigade till adelaide fire and those that are doing the response update  at HQ,get their filtered acttogether........

[backburn]

Cook my question still is who was the correct Fire Brigade that should have been responded as looking at the location on whereis.com they where the closest brigade.

[bittenyakka]

May be next time you need to say page XYZ brigade till adelaide fire and those that are doing the response update  at HQ,get their filtered acttogether........

hah we have been trying to get that to happen for years to no avail.

[chook]

When I contacted Adelaide fire, they said Lyrup was paged but didn't respond.
They then contacted Monash who could not get a crew, a member from Monash told me this. I thought Paringa would have been a better bet, but Monash was paged. Finally Berri SAMFS were paged, who responded. On my pager it says 73929(US)39324(LYRUP?). This is why in practice putting all of your eggs in one basket won't work. Finally I appologise to the Lyrup brigade(I didn't want to name brigades involved but you guys are too clever), who are a great bunch of guys and if your pagers didn't get the message that is a real problem that needs to be fixed. Again I didn't want to embarrass people or services, just to highlight that there are different issues in different parts of the state, so a one size fixes all approach wont work. cheers

[JamesGar]

If you notice on the pager sites that whenever there is an MVA, Car v Pedestrian etc etc there is a page sent to the ambulance and one to cap code 1924962

For example:

1924962 15:33:32 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala
1924690 15:33:30 06-09-07 G81 Cat2 Mallala-two Wells Rd, Mallala

 
1924962 14:36:47 06-09-07 RI400 Cat2 20 Belvidere Rd, Saddleworth
1924334 14:35:28 06-09-07 RI81 Cat 2 - V/A


1924962 08:59:18 06-09-07 SA81 Cat2 Grand Junction Rd, Hope Valley 96 G6
1908871 09:00:53 06-09-07 MFS: INC # 13 - 06/09/07 09:02,RESPOND RCR,GRAND JUNCTION RD,HOPE VALLEY, MAP 96 G 6 ,,BETWEEN RESERVOIR AND AROONGA POSSIBLE PERSONS TRAPPED,9419 301 329*CFSRES:


 

I would assume an RTL or Paramedic / ICP rostered to that area in the chance they are near by / available.

Negative is SOT

1924962 20:57:22 06-09-07 PP181 Cat2 Cnr Three Chain Rd, Port Pirie C228 N6 SAAS Supervisor?

Not SOT or SAAS Manager, message snet to the Road Accident Research Unit at the Adelaide University for data collection purposes

[Alan (Big Al)]

Thanks for that James.

[backburn]

When I contacted Adelaide fire, they said Lyrup was paged but didn't respond.
They then contacted Monash who could not get a crew, a member from Monash told me this. I thought Paringa would have been a better bet, but Monash was paged. Finally Berri SAMFS were paged, who responded. On my pager it says 73929(US)39324(LYRUP?). This is why in practice putting all of your eggs in one basket won't work. Finally I apologise to the Lyrup brigade(I didn't want to name brigades involved but you guys are too clever), who are a great bunch of guys and if your pagers didn't get the message that is a real problem that needs to be fixed. Again I didn't want to embarrass people or services, just to highlight that there are different issues in different parts of the state, so a one size fixes all approach wont work. cheers

I would have thought Paringa would have been the second call, they did get paged and respond then got stop call from Adelaida fire.Lyrup pagers did not receive 2 call outs that day not sure if they have had it looked into.

[chook]

Yep agree, Paringa should have been second fire call & obviously Lyrup must be having problems with their page messages.
The problem is that a) Paringa may have been on another job (we would not know), I don't know what the CFS protocols are in cases like this & finally there has been a fair bit of discussion around the closest resource - after two attempts that would be Berri Met (if you don't count Paringa which was mentioned should have been called over Monash).
The other issue I have to be careful of (and have most likely compromised now) is picking one brigade/service over another, I know how my unit would feel if one of the neighbouring units were getting selected over us by other services. For operational & other internal reasons at the time, we lost one of the towns we use to cover. From an outsider looking in (I was in the other unit at the time) it made perfect sense to me, however the unit members at the time were not happy at all!
And when I took over this unit, our first RCR task was to this particular town when I responded the other unit instead (as per a MOU) some of my unit members were very angry and are now not part of the unit!
So I try and keep the politics out of it and ask for fire cover from wherever they (Adelaide Fire) can get it.
Sorry this is a long reply however I have tried to put across a balanced view from where I sit, I realise everyone has various problems which sometimes fall outside of their control. But I do know from past experience that some our of fire fighting colleagues are not so careful about criticising us (even without facts) and throwing wild accusations around not caring about the damage it causes or reputations that are damaged(hidden agenda's?).
I hope that this post is taken in the spirit it meant and is not seen as a dig or criticism of the brigades/services involved. Cheers chook