Author Topic: Clinical?  (Read 19612 times)

Knackers

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Clinical?
« on: February 17, 2008, 04:19:48 AM »
How about us ambos/paramedics get some clinical topics/discussions going. Can be on anything, from experience of jobs (what would you do etc), to new treatment/management options etc.

I can't think of anything at the moment as it is 5.45am but if someone what's to kick it off that would be good.

Thanks,


Knackers.

Offline Alan (Big Al)

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2008, 04:29:43 PM »
Hmmm i hear leaches are good :-D
Lt. Goolwa CFS

Offline boredmatrix

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2008, 09:10:04 PM »
now that would just be upsetting the applecart...this is after all the SAFIREFIGHTER forum...


....on the other hand...a good excuse for more wind-ups!!

 :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:

Offline squiddy

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2008, 04:08:42 AM »
Hmmm i hear leaches are good :-D

Actually they are... as are maggots.

How about the talk regarding the statewide retrieval service? You read the discussion paper yet, Matrix?

Offline boredmatrix

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2008, 06:08:31 AM »
haven't seen it yet squid....you got a copy of it?

Offline Firefrog

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2008, 09:36:22 AM »
Everyone is welcome here! Ambos do support fire and rescue activities so chat away! :-D :-D :-D

Offline 6739264

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2008, 09:56:38 AM »
Its ok Boredmatrix, the firefighting aspect of this site was lost long ago.

Any intelligent discussion ends in "Call the SES we're bored and need a reason to exist"

Ahem... Continue, I'd be interested in clinical stuff to be honest.
To think they employed me as a drooling retard...

Offline jaff

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2008, 12:25:10 PM »
What about the pro's and con's of certain strategies or equipment like ,Stiches versus Staples, Handcuffs versus Leather..... oops sorry I digress!
Just Another Filtered Fireman

Offline boredmatrix

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2008, 04:18:28 PM »
jaff - with the latest stats showing that SAAS's workforce is over 45% female - I don't think it's out of line!!

others may however- disagree on the grounds of innapropriate sexual content!

I guess thats the end of that digression of topic then!   :-P

Offline chook

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2008, 04:53:38 PM »
Its ok Boredmatrix, the firefighting aspect of this site was lost long ago.

Any intelligent discussion ends in "Call the SES we're bored and need a reason to exist"

Ahem... Continue, I'd be interested in clinical stuff to be honest.
Ah Numbers - you have a cruel streak :roll:
And I'm interested in What's better - Hadcuffs or Leather too!
Seriously some info on clinical stuff would be good - after all we are bored and need something to do :-D
cheers
Ken
just another retard!

Offline 6739264

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2008, 05:18:12 PM »
I'm more of a fan of Leather, the wide straps are easier on the wrists.

To think they employed me as a drooling retard...

Offline chook

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2008, 05:22:09 PM »
Ok no worries thanks
Thats the first useful thing I have learn't on this forum :wink:
cheers
Ken
just another retard!

Knackers

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2008, 01:41:42 PM »
Well off to a good start, found out leather is preferred, and leaches will soon be in all medical kits.


Not sure about the Retrival Team thing. As far as I gather they work from the Harbour Town base during day and on-call during night. Inc an SOT, Dr and Nurse.


How about hydrocortisone, which ICP's will soon be using.  any other ideas?

Offline Firefrog

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2008, 02:27:07 PM »
And now back to the topic.

Offline bajdas

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2008, 02:34:36 PM »
And now back to the topic.

Can a seperate SAAS agency forum be created like SES, so that they are seperated & can grow....hint to moderators.
Andrew Macmichael
lives at Pt Noarlunga South.

My personal opinion only.

Offline 6739264

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2008, 02:41:34 PM »
How about we change the name of the site? It certainly isn't "For SA firefighters" anymore ;)
To think they employed me as a drooling retard...

Offline boredmatrix

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2008, 07:38:46 PM »


Not sure about the Retrival Team thing. As far as I gather they work from the Harbour Town base during day and on-call during night. Inc an SOT, Dr and Nurse.


How about hydrocortisone, which ICP's will soon be using.  any other ideas?

the retrieval one is an ongoing political hot potato.  Most other states use a paramedic and Dr for retrievals - SA is the only state that uses nurses for primary trauma - but the SOT is always dispatched for primary (airborne rotary wing)trauma responses.  Usually results in some doozy arguments!  got to love politics!

hydrocortisone?  nothing to it really besides being long overdue!  - tis something that should have been on the cars about 5 years ago!

rescue5271

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2008, 08:08:20 PM »
Time they looked at having a chopper based here in the SE for all medical emergency's and that it is staffed by a DOC and a SAAS paramedic would work well and I am sure they would get lots of work....RFDS is always too busy and that is why we are seeing the chopper come into Naracoorte a lot more than it used to...

Offline 24pumper

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2008, 08:43:25 PM »
Time they looked at having a chopper based here in the SE for all medical emergency's and that it is staffed by a DOC and a SAAS paramedic would work well

Not wanting to cause any issues, but why do we need a Doctor on primary trauma retreval??

This may be a loaded question, and very open to interpretation and personal view, but what can a Doctor add that a ICP cant.

rescue5271

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2008, 08:58:37 PM »
Well other state run it like that,so was just putting in my 20 cents worth..

Offline 24pumper

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #20 on: February 19, 2008, 09:34:07 PM »
Sorry Rescue5271, reading it again, it does look like my post was directly referenced to yours (which i suppose it is in part), was more interested in peoples thoughts on use of ICP's V Doctors in the pre-hospital environment.

Offline boredmatrix

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #21 on: February 20, 2008, 01:33:44 AM »

Not wanting to cause any issues, but why do we need a Doctor on primary trauma retreval??

This may be a loaded question, and very open to interpretation and personal view, but what can a Doctor add that a ICP cant.

um...yes - a very loaded question!  ICP's don't spend the better part of 10 years (ie: 6 of med school and another 4+ years of post-grad study)  specialising in Intensive Care Medicine!

yes - there may well be the argument for utilising ONLY paramedics on choppers - but the Doctor usually has more bags with more tricks up their sleeves than an ICP! (you can argue til you're blue in the face - but ICP's still have protocols!!)

......The point I was making was more along the lines of why is a nurse on a chopper?

The pre-hospital environment is obviously largely uncontrolled and susceptible to many forces as we all know.....so why is a nurse being put in it?

you may argue the point that a Dr is not a pre-hospital specialist either.  I argue that a Dr with a paramedic alongside him/her is much more useful than a Doc AND a nurse! The ICP is capable of working with the Doc - not FOR the Doc as is the case with the majority of nurses.

Offline squiddy

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #22 on: February 20, 2008, 06:40:02 AM »
Matrix: read the paper at work the other day... it has certainly caused a few waves. Basically it says that they want two retrieval teams working out of the airport with three permanent ambulances stationed with the choppers. A third retrival team would be hospital based. They are talking about having retrieval nurses undertake ambulance driving courses, and having nurses train ambos in aspects of retrival nursing. Apparently nurses are over-represented in retrievals.

As it currently stands, There is a team based in FMC and each shift there are three retrieval teams based in the RAH. If a retrieval is called, the chopped either flies to the RAH or FMC and picks up a crew, or an ambulance picks up a crew, depending on whether they want a road or air retrieval.

You ask why a nurse is present for retrievals. I think a lot of people underestimate just how much training a retrieval nurse goes through. After at least two full years experience as a registered nurse (three years at uni) in an ICU, they must do a post-grad diploma (another 2-3 years) in Critical Care, then they must pick up retrieval nursing (another couple of years at uni) or be doing the course before they can go out. They are trained in pre-hospital care and all facets of retrieval work. We no longer live in the dark ages where a nurse is subserviant to a doctor and only wipes bums and gives out pills. Nurses have protocols to follow and can make certain decisions, just like ICPs.

The reason a doctor is on a retrieval is because they are Intensive Care doctors. They are fully trained in keeping the sickest people alive. These people go to university for a great many years and then do time in hospitals looking at different facets of medicine and surgery, then they go and study to work in intensive care and have to work their way through the ranks there before they can work on retrievals.

As much as SOTs and ICPs have their place in a retrieval, they certainly wouldn't be jumping on an international flight to retrieve some poor filtered like the Bali Bombings or Jose Ramos Hortas when he got shot. Retrievals are also done through RFDS, and they happen every day for any number of reasons. Quite often all three retrieval teams are out at the RAH. I honestly don't think that the ambos could do it without the nurses, due to the fact that there are about 50 retrieval nurses in this state who work side-by-side with ambos. There is currently a shortage of ambos (and yes, there is a shortage of nurses, but not retrieval nurses) and if the nurses stopped going, it would pull ambos from other areas where they are already in short supply. We need our ambos out in the field for the calls made by the public. They do a great job, and I know that a lot of nurses certainly wouldn't want to be ambos and do their job. I know that 99% of the retrieval nurses I spoke with the other day with the discussion paper certainly don't want to learn to drive an ambulance...

Just my two cents worth... hope it answers some questions about how retrievals work...

Offline Alan (Big Al)

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #23 on: February 20, 2008, 08:22:45 AM »
I watched one of the retrieval nurses run a job one night because the doctor that came on the chopper could barely grasp the english language and had no idea what she was doing. Have to say though the nurse did a brilliant job. :|
Lt. Goolwa CFS

Offline jaff

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Re: Clinical?
« Reply #24 on: February 20, 2008, 08:47:44 AM »
Very interesting posts ,its great to get an insight into something different,could you medical types give us non medical types, some help with your acronyms. SOTs ,ICPs - intensive care paramedics?
What are the ,allowable treatment, differences between ambo's and paramadics and years of study/training?
In saying that i'm a non medical person I should qualify that by letting you know that ,I'm a legend in putting on wiggles bandaids, my kids think so anyway :-D

Cheers Jaff
Just Another Filtered Fireman