CFS Appliances - Not so bad?

[6739264]

As much as we all whine and moan about our appliances, we seem to lose sight of the fact that as both a fire service and a *volunteer* fire service we have things pretty good...

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,24071672-5006009,00.html

Fire trucks so old 60km/h's a struggle and defy safety laws

By Joe Hildebrand, Political Reporter

July 25, 2008 12:00am

SOME NSW fire trucks are so old they struggle to reach 60km/h - and 100 are in breach of the Government's own safety regulations.

Five years after the Government raised the maximum age of fire trucks from 15 to 20 years, The Daily Telegraph can reveal some trucks are 30 years old.

Firefighters are now threatening a work ban because the trucks are too slow and unsafe - a move that could leave regional communities exposed.

Just this week a 17-year-old truck was brought into Sydney's central fire station in Castle- reagh St because a newer machine was pulled out of service.

A breakdown buried in NSW Fire Brigades' latest annual report reveals that 93 trucks breach the 20-year cap.

Two trucks date back to 1978, another was commissioned in 1983 and 90 between 1984 and 1986.

Yet the Government's own 2004-2008 Fleet Replacement Program states unequivocally: "The attached plan has been formulated around the need to ensure operational appliances are replaced at no later than 18 years of age and are retired as service exchange vehicles by 20 years of age."

Even then NSWFB management came under fire for extending the lifespan from the previous 15 years. Two of the trucks are now twice that old. Officers say many of them struggle to reach 60km/h.

The Fire Brigades Employees Union will act unless the Government replaces the vehicles.

"The union is considering a ban if it focuses the Government on providing a modern fleet," FBEU secretary Simon Flynn told The Daily Telegraph.

"But the concern we have is that if we ban these old trucks then huge swathes of the state will be left completely unprotected and fireys take their responsibilities very seriously."

However Mr Flynn said the trucks themselves compromised public safety.

"These trucks are so old they have exceeded their design life and the manufacturers' guidelines," he said.

"These trucks barely hit 60km/h on a flat road, so there is an impact on response times."

A NSWFB spokeswoman said the average age of the 669-strong fleet of fire appliances - which includes fire engines, 4WD bushfire tankers, and aircraft - was just over nine years.

However she conceded there were older vehicles.

"As new vehicles are delivered, older ones are decommissioned or those in the best condition are kept in reserve to use as 'service exchange vehicles' and for major emergencies (such as natural disasters and prolonged bushfire campaigns)," she said.

"Some of these vehicles are under 15 years and others are over 20 years old."

[chook]

Its certainly a point to ponder isn't it?

[Cameron Yelland]

I see what you are saying numbers but on the other hand should we accept substandard appliances just because another state has it worse than us?

[Pipster]

The article talks about the NSW Fire Brigade, and comments from the Union regarding the vehicles....so is it the paid service, or it is the rural fire service?    I'm a bit confused by the terminology in the article...

Pip

[chook]

Pip NSWFB is all over NSW & has rural fire capability to assist RFS. They are also the providers of Hazmat response & just about everything else you can think of. There are towns in the Western area of the state that in SA would battle to sustain a CFS crew but they have NSWFB retained, so I guess thats why they would have rural appliances.
And no I'm not supporting putting up with substandard equipment, but at least its new substandard equipment
Seriously though the NSWFB is a very different animal to what we are used to & I'm surprised that they would have issues as described. Maybe it's a bit of a beat up because the volunteer services have had a huge budget increase due to safety & other concerns the government had with the NSW Government Volunteer services (mainly SES with their second hand furniture trucks). VRA in many areas are having similar problems, with equipment reliability. And when the interstate people arrived in NSW for the Newcastle & Sydney storms I think the NSW service was slightly embarrassed by the lack of equipment (the standard of the Victorian gear mainly). So maybe the fire guys might be doing some agitating (again!)
cheers

[rescue5271]

Must be the old bedfords and early mercs that they have....

[6739264]

I see what you are saying numbers but on the other hand should we accept substandard appliances just because another state has it worse than us?

Not at all am I suggesting that we should accept sub standard appliances, all I was trying to do was make people rethink just how bad things apparently are. Many people seem to see SAMFS as the be all and end all of firefighting "They're paid, they are the ultimate". I'm just suggesting that just because you have a large budget and are a 'Professional Service' doesn't mean that you can get things right all the time.

Ofcourse there is always room to improve, we shouldn't sit on our hands and just take what we are given, but just don't forget that we are very, very well off for a volunteer service. People seem to lose sight of that fact occaisionally.

The article talks about the NSW Fire Brigade, and comments from the Union regarding the vehicles....so is it the paid service, or it is the rural fire service?    I'm a bit confused by the terminology in the article...

Pip

Pip, 'NSW Fire Brigades' is the paid service, with the NSW Fire Brigades Employees Union (FBEU) being the NSW equivalent of the SAUFU. The Volunteer service is the 'NSW Rural Fire Service'. The article is mainly concerned with the issue that the paid service has ancient appliances as both in service and as spares.

[chook]

The other thing to remember to is 20 years old is not ancient. And a federal government department is still using trucks that are over 20 years old! And they replaced trucks that were 30 years old. It's how well they are maintained & how much use they are getting. I can't see a problem using old trucks as spares, as long as the equipment is safe to operate & can still do the job, then it shouldn't matter how old it is! (I know what they are saying in the article, but we all know how people exaggerate!)
Yanco-Wamoon (a small RFS brigade) just picked up a new appliance at a cost of $215,000 & for the first time toilets in their shed! This is occurring all over the state with RFS & SES, so I think it may be a bit of "we want some of the pie too" stuff!
Anyway I tend to agree with Numbers, as a state we are considerably well off with the type & level of equipment we have & whilst I agree that the build quality on some of the vehicles may be questionable, what I have noticed is a lot of the complaints about the CFS fleet is not that it is substandard but in fact it doesn't quite meet everyones idea of what an appliance should be.
And as I said previously you can't have everything, it's either a compromise or it's meet everyone's expectations but have less vehicles to go around. I.e. Busy high profile brigades get their Urban pumper, Rural pumper, & Rescue/ Salvage trucks (and every thing else they want) & those who are out of the limelight & away from the city are stuck with the old Hino's for another 20 years
And out of interest we will get no new vehicles this year!
cheers