Author Topic: Is it or isn't it????  (Read 17994 times)

Offline jaff

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Is it or isn't it????
« on: August 12, 2008, 12:56:34 AM »
Bombs...........check,
chemical........check,
biological......check,
radiological....check,
redheads........What?

So we have all been clued up on the likely terrorist attack methods, but what about if someone during a particuarly dry warm spell that we suffer through each year, set large numbers of fires in vunerable areas at exactly the same time.
Now imagine if it happened in WA, SA, VIC, ACT, NSW simaltaneously.
Imagine that scenario, the devastation that it could potentially cause over great areas affecting a massive amount of the Australian population!
When you look at the challenges just SA would face its scary.
Even the Salvo's would have trouble supplying that much Spam, pineapple,beetroot and potato salad to all the hungry firey's! :-D
What are your thoughts?
Just Another Filtered Fireman

Offline SA Firey

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2008, 01:44:12 AM »
Hope it never happens, but back on Ash Wednesday everyone from all the Ladies Auxillary of the brigades were making sandwiches and anything else we could get our hands on.
What also made the task hard was the power was out, so no fuel, no cooking unless you had gas.I spent 36 hours straight on the fireground with appliances from as far as the Barossa Valley...:-o
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Offline 6739264

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2008, 06:48:00 PM »
I heard that the Salvos have an underground bunker full of nothing but Spam and 'mint' peas. Enough to feed the country's emergency services for a year atleast. (Depending on if they want to feed the SES, they are meant to be able to cook for themselves)
To think they employed me as a drooling retard...

Offline bittenyakka

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2008, 07:15:47 PM »
It is interesting you ask.
Considering it kinda happened on KI last summer and was a completely natural occurance it could feasibly happen with no human interference. we just need to hope it doesn't happen in a highly populated area.

Offline 6739264

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2008, 07:38:52 PM »
But if it does its ok, WE HAVE AIR SUPPORT!


Or rather, the BIG BRAVE SKYCRANES have some minor assistance on the ground from "Fire brigades" or something like that.
To think they employed me as a drooling retard...

Offline Bagyassfirey

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2008, 08:45:01 PM »
id be more worried bout fires starting of natural causes or machinery failure. think were in 4 a long summer theres some massive fuel loads building thru the YP and Mid North...not to mention elsewhere

Offline bajdas

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2008, 10:00:13 PM »
I heard that the Salvos have an underground bunker full of nothing but Spam and 'mint' peas. Enough to feed the country's emergency services for a year atleast. (Depending on if they want to feed the SES, they are meant to be able to cook for themselves)

many years ago it was the Mormons who have the emergency bunker food stores and at that time, I understood they will allow access has part of the state disaster plan.
Andrew Macmichael
lives at Pt Noarlunga South.

My personal opinion only.

Offline 6739264

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2008, 10:44:31 PM »
I had an ex-girlfriend who had stocks of canned goods for such an eventuality.

She also mentioned something about the government and aliens...

Yeah, I love the crazy...
To think they employed me as a drooling retard...

Offline RescueHazmat

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2008, 11:53:11 PM »
Bombs...........check,
chemical........check,
biological......check,
radiological....check,
redheads........What?

So we have all been clued up on the likely terrorist attack methods, but what about if someone during a particuarly dry warm spell that we suffer through each year, set large numbers of fires in vunerable areas at exactly the same time.
Now imagine if it happened in WA, SA, VIC, ACT, NSW simaltaneously.
Imagine that scenario, the devastation that it could potentially cause over great areas affecting a massive amount of the Australian population!
When you look at the challenges just SA would face its scary.
Even the Salvo's would have trouble supplying that much Spam, pineapple,beetroot and potato salad to all the hungry firey's! :-D
What are your thoughts?

We stretch a line, and dig in.. Just like we always do..

Offline 6739264

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2008, 12:00:49 AM »
We stretch a line, and dig in.. Just like we always do..

I carry a WWII era German entrenching tool in my CBRN(E) pack for such occasions.
To think they employed me as a drooling retard...

Offline bajdas

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2008, 10:04:47 PM »
...set large numbers of fires in vunerable areas at exactly the same time.
Now imagine if it happened in WA, SA, VIC, ACT, NSW simaltaneously.
Imagine that scenario, the devastation that it could potentially cause over great areas affecting a massive amount of the Australian population!
When you look at the challenges just SA would face its scary.....

Australia would not be able to mitigate fully any natural disaster that would affect multiple states of Australia..hopefully the EMA and others have plans to call in other countries (eg USA) as needed.

In SA, my crystal ball predicts, it would be life protection & critical asset protection for a week plus by everyone. I believe lives & townships would be lost.

By critical assets I mean the stuff like the electricity interlink (large % of state electricity for many months), freight to get food & fuel (I think we only have a few weeks of petrol in storage), major industries, hospitals, etc.

Twenty years ago I did scenarios of an earthquake on the fault line that runs under Flinders Medical Centre & Marion Shopping Centre. This was a desktop exercise in emergency planning in our response zone (Mitcham) that considered that South Road was cut & the southern metropolitan suburbs was a mess.

I assume you have seen a large emergency plan for your response area that I think is co-ordinated by the Police.

If you run the desktop exercise in your township, stating you are the first emergency service responders with what you have around you to work with. Nothing else. Backup strike-force & aircraft resources are not available for 24 hours from now, because they are cut-off by the fire & deployed elsewhere.

Where would you place an evacuation, triage centre ? What are the critical assets in your area & how would you protect them from looters & fire, with the resources you have ? Do you know how to contact extra resources like community service clubs (Lions, Rotary, etc) to mann the evacuation centre ? What do the Scout groups have that could be used (tents, camp cooking facilties, etc) ? What can transport/trucking companies supply ? Do you know how to contact the WICEN amateur radio operators in your area ? How would you supply toilets & drinking water for the evacuation centre ? Do you know where the gas, eletricity & water distribution centres are ? Red Cross and Dept Families & Communities do the people tracking. Do you know who the people are in those departments ?

The list is endless and interesting....

A comment made a few years ago, that has always stayed with me "...a major fire was burning in a community & township. The emergency planners decided to save the houses & risk the industry. The industry complex was lost to fire....several years later the township was deserted...the cause was that the industry decided it was not worth rebuilding, so they closed. No one was employed, so the people left the township".

Which caused the more damage to the community. The fire or the decision ?

To me, no answer is ever 100% right to hard questions. But this could be a scenario for the long term survival of your local community.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2008, 10:16:54 PM by bajdas »
Andrew Macmichael
lives at Pt Noarlunga South.

My personal opinion only.

Offline bittenyakka

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2008, 10:20:14 PM »
That sounds like a very interesting scenario to run Andrew. is there anyone you would recommend talking to about how to have on of them run in your group/local area?

Offline bajdas

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #12 on: August 13, 2008, 10:41:34 PM »
That sounds like a very interesting scenario to run Andrew. is there anyone you would recommend talking to about how to have on of them run in your group/local area?

I would find out who the local emergency planning person (not just fire, but any major emergency) is in your area. I would expect this to be the police or council.

If unsure, contact the local SASES Regional Officer who will have a copy and the contacts. If not, call SA SES SHQ on 08 8463 4171. The state planners & co-ordinators of the SA State Emergency Centre are attached to SES.

If you have a few different organisations participating, get them together for a BBQ, then ran the desktop exercise together. Each organisation has its own priorities & some will get bogged down in details/arguments before making a decision.

This is also why AIIMS process is used to segregate the tasks.

My suggestion is for the desktop exercise co-ordinators to:

* get a large map of the area that can be placed on a wall.
* create a timeline of events (eg 0700 fire starts at location A, B & C. 0830 resources overcome by windshift & major transport routes cut. 0900 major infrastructure threatened. 0930 major people centre (eg hospital) threatened, add a hazmat/RCR truck collision in as well, etc)
* in the above timeline, your group is planning/working from 0845 onwards. Allow the groups 10 mins before you give them the next problem or issue. If the groups take too long to issue a decision, state that they have lost the facility & lives because they took too long.
* allow enough time for a debrief of the exercise to see if participants thought it was worth while.
Andrew Macmichael
lives at Pt Noarlunga South.

My personal opinion only.

Offline Robert-Robert34

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2008, 09:29:18 PM »
Quote
Where would you place an evacuation, triage centre ? What are the critical assets in your area & how would you protect them from looters & fire, with the resources you have ? Do you know how to contact extra resources like community service clubs (Lions, Rotary, etc) to mann the evacuation centre ? What do the Scout groups have that could be used (tents, camp cooking facilties, etc) ? What can transport/trucking companies supply ? Do you know how to contact the WICEN amateur radio operators in your area ? How would you supply toilets & drinking water for the evacuation centre ? Do you know where the gas, eletricity & water distribution centres are ? Red Cross and Dept Families & Communities do the people tracking. Do you know who the people are in those departments ?

Dont forget the other radio monitoring services such as ACRM and the local amateur radio group cause you'll be needing radio communications on both the 2 metre band and UHF CB band
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Offline RescueHazmat

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2008, 07:37:09 PM »
We stretch a line, and dig in.. Just like we always do..

I carry a WWII era German entrenching tool in my CBRN(E) pack for such occasions.
HaHa :lol:

Offline Bagyassfirey

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2008, 07:39:30 PM »
i see our fearless premier mr rann likened the stealing of water to some one lighting bushfires. which he called terrorism.

Offline Robert-Robert34

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2008, 09:16:55 PM »
Quote
We stretch a line, and dig in.. Just like we always do..
Quote
I carry a WWII era German entrenching tool in my CBRN(E) pack for such occasions.

If we had to build a trench just to combat a bushfire we would be a new breed of Anzac troops  :-D
Kalangadoo Brigade

Offline jaff

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #17 on: August 15, 2008, 09:20:36 PM »
We stretch a line, and dig in.. Just like we always do..

I carry a WWII era German entrenching tool in my CBRN(E) pack for such occasions.



Yep do the same numbers along with a roll of butt tickets   :-D
Just Another Filtered Fireman

Offline JC

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #18 on: August 15, 2008, 09:22:58 PM »
meh, were on an island its not going to go anywhere...  :-D  :-D  :-D

But in all seriousness if there was fires in everystate i think it would be every state for themselves.
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Offline Bagyassfirey

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #19 on: August 15, 2008, 09:41:02 PM »
meh, were on an island its not going to go anywhere...  :-D  :-D  :-D

But in all seriousness if there was fires in everystate i think it would be every state for themselves.

yea bugger the mexicans  :wink:

Offline jaff

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2008, 10:34:43 PM »
meh, were on an island its not going to go anywhere...  :-D  :-D  :-D

But in all seriousness if there was fires in everystate i think it would be every state for themselves.

yea bugger the mexicans  :wink:


From what I remember of my workplace dignity training, buggering is probably not allowed,  :-D
Just Another Filtered Fireman

Offline Zippy

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Re: Is it or isn't it????
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2008, 06:16:21 AM »
meh, were on an island its not going to go anywhere...  :-D  :-D  :-D

But in all seriousness if there was fires in everystate i think it would be every state for themselves.

yea bugger the mexicans  :wink:


From what I remember of my workplace dignity training, buggering is probably not allowed,  :-D

filtered that....bugger is australian slang!