Urban Firefighting Training - the LACK of

[pumprescue]

Since the terrible fires of Wangary and the like the CFS had almost solely focused on rural training. There has been the regular BA courses, and I have heard a rumour of alarm panel training, but haven't seen the course yet.

Anyway, my point is, have we neglected our urban brigades. Whilst rural brigades do make up probably 90% of the service, we do have some brigades with urban risks and urban workloads. Apart from BA they are having to self teach themselves all other urban related tasks.

I would be interested to hear what the new Chief says on the matter. Granted we are the Country Fire Service, but we seem to insist on only being the Country in the Country Fire Service.

What are your thoughts first.....

[bittenyakka]

We probably lack in both areas..

I have done check installed fire saftey systems and it isn't to bad.

If we were to train the volly firefighters to a good level of  training what would be the key urban skills? and yoh have a max of 2 weekends per year per person. ( i jsut want to get beyond the standard thoughts on SAFf)

[pumprescue]

I don't think it has to all be courses at STC, but training packages to deliver in house, a consistent level of training not what you have picked up along the way, The only skills my members have learnt is what we have picked up along the way. Thats all well and good if you maintain a good level of membership over many years, but who's to say you are doing it right.

God help us if we ever screwed an urban job up..."show us your urban firefighting package....."

Also some officer training...again everything is rural based.

[misterteddy]

I would be interested to hear what the new Chief says on the matter.

the who??? 

[6739264]

Since the terrible fires of Wangary and the like the CFS had almost solely focused on rural training. There has been the regular BA courses, and I have heard a rumour of alarm panel training, but haven't seen the course yet.

Anyway, my point is, have we neglected our urban brigades. Whilst rural brigades do make up probably 90% of the service, we do have some brigades with urban risks and urban workloads. Apart from BA they are having to self teach themselves all other urban related tasks.

First of all, perhaps we need to move away from the idea of "Urban" brigades and "Rural" brigades. Only for a second.

Find me a brigade WITHOUT a single structure in their area, and we can call them but a "Rural" brigade. For everyone else, like it or not, they have an Urban risk. We used to teach basic structural fire response in Level 3, but that was removed and not replaced.

The CFS has certainly neglected its Urban firefighting training, as apart from CFBT, we get nothing. There is a huge amount of information to know, and principles to understand that pertain to urban firefighting but this is not available. Things like the Check Installed Fire Safety Systems course is great, but it's a baby step forward.

Sadly, I believe that it is only by shear luck that we have not had anyone seriously injured or killed in a structure fire, given what little official training we are given.

Perhaps a suggestion of the basics:

Booster Systems
Forcible Entry
Fire Attack / Hose Handling (Yes CFBT does cover parts of this)
Search and Rescue
Thermal Imaging Camera use
Rapid Intervention Teams
Ventilation
Salvage
Overhaul
Use of Gas Detection to determine level of PPE required

Some of this could be incorporated into weekend long training packages (eg: Suppress Urban Fire) or it could be presented to a handful of people who can then take it back to their brigade/group and teach it in small hour long sessions and practicals to help flesh out a yearly training calendar. Not all of this has to be taught by staff at STC.

It's not going to happen overnight and I know that certain staff are pushing hard to change things. I just hope the CFS grows up and realises its changing role sooner rather than later. It shouldn't have to take deaths to get proper training implemented.

[unfknblvable]

Or maybe start with BA??

[6739264]

Or maybe start with BA??

Sure, we'll start with a course that we already have implemented. Sounds like a good place to start discussing a lack of training.

My post was made assuming that OBAOC was taught as it already is. Sorry if I failed to make this clear enough.

[misterteddy]

Or maybe start with BA??

so enlighten us and give us the benefit of your wealth of experience. What would you do with BA?

[BundyBear]

6739264

You've hit the nail straight on top of the head, I think at a corporate level for a long time rural firefighting has been their major concern and I understand fully that it is one of the greatest threats to the state.

Unfortunately if you look at the statistics of what brigades are responded to presently and the possibilities of what they can be responded to the CFS needs to be in a position to cover all threats and provide the best service to the community.

The SFEC's need to be abolished and brigades being called rural/urban or urban/rural. The training and equipment needs to be upgraded to meet requirements for the service presently and into the future.

For example the 34P appliances you can not just drag out the side line from the appliance and drag it into a structure fire as it does not produce the required 750 k.p.a. at the branch you must lay out 1 line 3 lengths of 38mm hose. If you ever get to use a HP hose line off an MFS applaince at an incident, the difference is like chalk and cheese!