Responding to Incidents

[oz fire]

Maybe there is another side - Chain of Command.

A GO arrives prior to the fire crews and directs activities - thats a fair call for their position in the Chain of Command. All be it that this could be left to the first arriving officer (in an appliance) therefore allowing the upgrade to include the GO to commence the AIIMS process.

As a brigade officer it is frustrating, when you arrive and the GO (hopefully in PPE, although not always) is on site barking orders, rather than assisting to coordinate.

Maybe put the shoe on the other foot - how would the GO feel if a Regional Officer reponded (due to the nature of the call that was received) arrived first and then directed them, and the brigades what to do - now I don't think to many GO's would appreciate that.

Ultimately though (from my view) if they respond, they should support the OIC of the first appliance, mentor them, guide them and then only step up if required and requested too

[Del]

You are right oz fire. The role of the GO, DGO is, as i see it a support role initially, assisting the OIC of the first arriving appliance. Until the incident escalates and the GO / DGO assumes the role of Incident controller or Operations officer. There is huge advantages in having an officer on scene minutes before the arrival of an appliance.

The Fire and Emergency Services Act, States, "....an incident controlleror, if an incident controller has not been appointed, the most senior member of SACFS in attendance, may assume control..."  I guess its a mater of brigades ensuring they communicate with their Group Officers and have a plan in place of how incidents will be handled in relation to the response of Group Officers to incidents. At the end of the day it is the Brigades that elect their Group Officers.

[rescue5271]

Why does the IC Or OPS roles have to be a group officer or his/her dept,there are some GROUPIES out there that have not done the courses to take on these roles. If you have done the course and you know what you are doing then the OIC on the first arriving appliances should be the IC...

[nomex_nugget]

I think you'll find that the new COSO / SOP's about to be handed out say something like 'Paid staff and Group OFficers can only respond priority one to jobs that are second alarm or above'. That should mean no more Group officrs responding to every job they think sounds exciting.

It is unnecessary for a Deputy to respond to a Private alarm or MVA just because they were sitting at home bored.

[medevac]

had a group vehicle turn up to a private alarm at 0100 the other day, no upgrade to alarm or anything like that... was like "what the hell???"

[Firefrog]

I'm sure some GO's attend for the wrong reasons to some of these small jobs, but had you considered that some might attend to be seen by the brigades and have a working presence in the group.

If GO's don't occasionally come to small jobs how do new people get to know them and understand how they work.

We can't have a situation where GO's are relegated to big jobs only. The key here is the attitude of the GO's and the brigade officers, it needs to be a working cooperation not an adversarial relationship.

In my opinion if the GO or Deputy wants to come & say high at a fixed alarm in the morning then that's fine as long as the person has the attitude of I'm here to say high lend a hand if asked but not here to take over.

[strikeathird]

If I saw the GO for nearly everycall I would start to think he questioned my ability as an officer, and thats why he kept coming.

I think this was created as a whinge because obviosuly some ones GO was coming to either, Small things, when he wasn't needed, or coming P1 to jobs he either A) Wasn't needed for, or B) the use for P1 driving and coming before the fire appliance was useless..

Any way, this could drag on for months...

At the end of the day, they are GO's, and as much as we may not like it, they have the right to pick and chose, and come to what ever they wish.  That is why, they are a Group officer.

If you don't like that, it's simple, vote them out.

[fire03rescue]

We have had GO respond to small jobs to get to see how we do things ie can we do better, I have no problem with this ( they sit back and just observe)
and other times when they are new to the position and want to see how other brigades work.
This only happened for a short time, all was fine.
But going to every call with no real reason who be a problem

[kat]

Once we had the kind of Group Officer who, if he showed up at 2am to a fixed alarm, we would welcome with open arms. Unfortunately he's gone the way of many of our really good people and left the service.

I guess the GO's span of control is the whole group and if they choose to come and have a look see at an incident it is completely withing their "operational (and other) responsibilities".

And if the OIC of the single Brigade involved believes that the GO is taking over control unecessarily I guess they can advise the GO of that

And if the GO wants to take over anyway, maybe they don't trust the Brigade OIC.

And if the Brigade OIC's think the GO is an annoyance and a siren jockey I guess they don't vote him/her in next time round. 

[CFS_Firey]

And if the Brigade OIC's think the GO is an annoyance and a siren jockey I guess they don't vote him/her in next time round. 

If they can find someone who is willing to stand for election

[backburn]

Not sure where I should ask this question but this spot will do. Was responding to a incident the other day in to samfs area and they told us to change to a code green responce? not sure what that is can any one help.

[strikeathird]

Code GREEN is Priority 2 = NO light, NO siren, normal driving conditions.

Code RED is Priority 1 = Lights and Sirens.




(Also called Code 1 (Priority 1) - Code 2 (Priority 2)

[backburn]

Thanks now I can tell the other members.

[kat]

Or maybe we could start the debate in this thread about whether they should have just told you to continue priority two, or even plainer continue with no lights and sirens.

If an accident were to occur after continuing at P1 after being advised to downgrade it could be an interesting investigation.

"Why did you continue to drive under lights and sirens after being advised not to?"

"cos we didn't know what the transmission meant and were too embarrassed to ask"

Reminds me of about 17 years ago when I first joined and was on the radio when asked to respond second rescue. Didn't know what it meant and too embarrassed to ask over radio(before mobiles days). Just as well next transmission within a few minutes was to stand down second rescue.

[oz fire]

Code GREEN is Priority 2 = NO light, NO siren, normal driving conditions.
Code RED is Priority 1 = Lights and Sirens.
(Also called Code 1 (Priority 1) - Code 2 (Priority 2)

From what I have heard, the majority of the SAMFS commcen staff now use priority one and two as colours have other meanings - probally just an older commcen officer, struggling to change.

Does make you think how easy it would be if we all had the same prowords and communications standards - but thats another topic, story and .....