SA Firefighter

General Discussion => Other Government Agencies => Topic started by: CFS_Firey on August 10, 2005, 06:07:06 PM

Title: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on August 10, 2005, 06:07:06 PM
There has been some interesting discussion in other threads http://www.safirefighter.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=53&topic=75 about what the SES does, and when the CFS uses them...
Some people expressed views that the CFS might be taking over some of the roles that the SES traditionally played, and not used them when they should.

So I'm interested in how other brigades use the SES... Do you respond them as back up, (eg traffic control), how close are you to them (eg, do you ever train together), and do you see a need for the SES to have more of a role?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on August 10, 2005, 08:46:43 PM
I hadn't been at a job with the SES for a LONG time (ever infact), till that big storm hit a month or so ago.  Even then, seemed like there were more CFS members tarping roofs, and sandbagging.

Altho, being a more urban brigade, they arent used often. 


OOppss, I remember, only time(s) were 2 jobs, both car VS house.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: mengcfs on August 11, 2005, 04:34:01 PM
In our area the SES is responded when the CFS is (for VA's anyway) generally for traffic. They are a RCR unit but numbers are dwindling so the CFS and SES work together on that as the CFS has members trained. Usually for storm/flood damage both servcies are responded. The only thing that SES does solo is water rescue, other than that CFS do it or both services.
Adam
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Mike on August 16, 2005, 08:11:08 AM
SES are the primary RCR for our area. Most of the jobs they do are attended by both services, and this has happened for a number of years. The general idea is that we are there for the same reasons in the end, and none of us should be upset about being asked to lend a hand (if it does.. why are ya in the service?).

There have been a few times where members have tried to paint them as the 'enemy' but that gets jumped on pretty quick.

Anyways, their main roles for our area:

RCR, Vertical, Landsearch, Storm, USAR, Water Ops (support only)....
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_fire32 on August 16, 2005, 12:25:31 PM
Up until a couple of years ago (3 or 4), we were a joint CFS/SES "unit" in which the majority of people were CFS and SES members.  We would jointly crew rescue apliances as necessary for MVA's.
However a split occured and this caused a bit of trouble between the two services, in terms of people being able to commit themselves between the two. Fortunately, CFS retained most memebrs, but SES lost quite a few, consequently the reason why we have so many CFS RCR trained crew. However, today we still have several joint members and this does not present many, if any problems for the crew.

Our situation today, with SES as descrbied by Mike is similar to that of 'mengcfs'.  SES are the primary rescue tender for our area, however being that our CFS has a number of trained and experienced CFS RCR members (about 7 or 8 I think), we carry a set of RCR gear on our 24P.  It is very old and very heavy, second hand gear, but there have been a couple of times when we have come very close to using it.  Hopefully, we are getting another second hand set of gear very soon.  I have heard it is much newer than the antiques we have, and most importantly much lighter.  However, I would like our brigade to eventually get a Holmatro Rapid Intervention set - one day anyway.

Our aim - which has been put in place and is nearly complete - is to get our CFS brigade in the "official" position of secondary rescue response, in which if SES have trouble providing a full crew, which sometimes happens, especially during the day time, then a CFS RCR member(s) will make up the rescue team.  Also, if CFS arrive on scence before SES and their ETA is greater than 5 minutes, then we (CFS) will begin the rescue and SES on arrival will work in with their RCR crew and 'very nice' equipment to make sure that the rescue continues to run smoothly and efficiently.

Quite recently, we have had a couple of rescues where both our services have done exactly this - worked togther smoothly and efficiently.  Also, we have done some joint RCR training and definitely look to do much more of it in the very near future.

At the end of the day, we both share a common goal of providing the best service we can to the community and if this means we both share the rcr role to a certain degree, be it that SES are still the primary tender, then I don't think there is anybody who will disagree, especially myself.

In todays world, when the people willing to become RCR trained crew are getting harder and harder to find -like most thiings- it is impecable that services put their past and differences behind them and work together as a team, no matter what colour overalls they are wearing.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on August 16, 2005, 12:38:26 PM
Sensational Post!
At the end of the day, we both share a common goal of providing the best service we can to the community

Cheers to the two services and to the individuals to forget the colour of the uniform and the differneces and to put their communitiy and families first!

Well Done :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on August 25, 2005, 07:59:08 AM
We dont have SES in Naracoorte we did along time ago have a joint ses/cfs station but a few problems came up and all members became CFS members so no more SES. SES have there place and maybe in large urban area's they do a great job but has been the case over the last few years there's and our number's are falling.

There are a number of very strong SES units around the state who work very well with CFS and yes they all have the same job in mind as we do..
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on September 08, 2005, 11:51:56 AM
WEll can I just ask a dumb question Adam from Meningie, why, as a tax payer am I paying for CFS to run 2 services. Why are they still trying to prop up the SES in a small town that probably doesn't have loads of people to spare. I see a lot of that, and it seems that we pay for a whole lot of vehicles, uniforms and equipment for the CFS to do it anyway, what gives there?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Mike on September 08, 2005, 12:09:57 PM
Hold up a second there..... CFS isnt running 2 services, the state is.
Even if we had 1 service, the same number of vehicles would be required.
Dont forget that these people are just as dedicated to the service and the community as everyone else, and shouldn't be pesecuted as such.

The following link contains thoughts on combining the services:

http://www.safirefighter.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=53&topic=214.0\
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: kat on September 08, 2005, 03:31:16 PM
Do you think we'd need the same number of vehicles?

Tailem doesn't have an SES, the CFS does RCR and assorted other stuff (no, not boat stuff) but we only have two appliances same as, for example, Meningie CFS. We have double the population and a higher SFEC risk rating. But manage with two multi purpose vehicles...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Mike on September 08, 2005, 03:36:58 PM
I think we would.... maybe not when looking at command vehicles, but definately trucks. This conclusion is based on knowing what both services in our area carry. There is no way we would be able to fit the gear required for all types of taskings the services do.

After all we all have enough trouble fitting what we want to carry at the moment.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on September 10, 2005, 12:17:18 PM
Does it matter how many appliances ses has?? as a tax payer I could ask the same question of say some CFS hills groups that have way to many command cars and brigades that each have a over kill of RCR gear when they are not a primary RCR brigade.

Time some people came out to the country and see how country brigades do things and hey it would be nice to have a RCR brigade just around the corner but we are in the real world here..
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 10, 2005, 02:31:08 PM
rescue5271 - differant areas have differant risks and require differant standards of cover... fact of the matter is a lot of hills brigades do more than four times the amount of MOST country brigades - and therefore it is only logical for more equipment to be placed in these areas.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on September 10, 2005, 10:06:29 PM
That may be true but from what I have read in stats for the past 3 years my brigade and others in the country attend more jobs than some city brigades......
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 10, 2005, 11:41:40 PM
thats why i said "times the amount of MOST country brigades"

correct me if im wrong bill but your from naracoorte?

from what i understand in naracoorte station at the moment is a brand new 34, a 2 year old pumper and a fairly new stand alone rescue appliance.

better than a lot of hills/city brigades

last year you did 141 jobs, morphett vale did 347 with a 24 and a 24P??

im not saying you dont deserve the number of trucks you have.. i think you definitely need them there. just saying that you cant possibly compare our response areas here to yours out in country areas. there are to many variables...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on September 12, 2005, 07:41:44 AM
Firetruck, at the prsent we have a 5 year old pumper that is slowly rusting away and has cost lots of money to keep it going,we have a 12 month old 34 and our stand alone rescue is 3 years old. Yes we all have differnt risks and we all fight fires different,as for the appliances in Naracoorte we have a urban risk/a large rescue risk and our large rural risk with in the group we have had to work hard for our stand alone rescue as we have been to jobs where all the gear has come of the unit just to do the job and our next back up for rescue is 50 kms south at penola and 45 kms north at padthaway and 65 kms west at lucindale..

By the way the last time I looked morphet vale had 3 appliances and they do have back up closer than we do...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 12, 2005, 08:24:52 AM
believe morphett vale's 3rd truck the 14, was funded entirely by the brigade
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: TillerMan on September 12, 2005, 11:35:46 AM
Don't forget morphett 0.4 if they still have it. :mrgreen:
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: kat on September 12, 2005, 12:44:54 PM
Nope 0.4 is at Meningie now :-)
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on September 12, 2005, 01:36:03 PM
Population equals incidents, Incidents equals equipment, but anyway, what does this have to do with the SES?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 12, 2005, 09:16:37 PM
Population equals incidents, Incidents equals equipment,

i reckon its more like; population equals risk, risk equals equipment
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on September 13, 2005, 10:04:35 AM
i reckon its more like; population equals risk, risk equals equipment

Tell that to Roseworthy who has a tiny population and then has the college, glass factory and alike - risk has nothing to do with population.

Maybe Stirling North - they have a small population but then the risk of a power station and prision! I guess there is a reasonable population in the prison though!

Millicent and the HUGE factory down there - small population, huge risk!!

These days risk and popualtion have very little to do with each other.

Dollar wise theres more risk in the Stirling North response area than the whole of the Sturt Group - does that mean Stirling North get the equivelant budget, resourcing etc  - no - it'c called risk management and that is how we determin resources for what ever service!
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on September 13, 2005, 10:08:34 AM
No, its called SAMFS have millions of dollars of gear down the road, we will just use them instead of doing it properly.

But again, we digress.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on September 13, 2005, 10:13:44 AM
Digressing,

The majority of SAMFS millions goes on paying the highest f/f wages in Australia.

They appear to always have new equipment as they are a small service - tiny compared to interstate and compared to CFS - plus when they build a truck it gets delivered in Adelaide so gets media coverage, when we deliver a truck, build a station it happens anywhere in the 96% of SA that we look after.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Toast on September 13, 2005, 12:52:51 PM
Well, getting back to the topic, the only time I have ever seen the SES turn out to anything here int he hills was to a tree vs. house an hour after we had started working. There isnt much around here for them to do apart from USAR if needed and their search fucntion if it was ever needed...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: 24P on September 13, 2005, 06:15:21 PM
Quote

Tell that to Roseworthy who has a tiny population and then has the college, glass factory and alike - risk has nothing to do with population.
Quote
The college is actually in Mudla Wirras area which is based on the campus grounds, so that wouldnt really count as a risk to Roseworthy, be a bit like Salisbury claiming GMH was a risk to them cause its only across the road but in MFS area
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 14, 2005, 01:43:14 AM
Well, getting back to the topic, the only time I have ever seen the SES turn out to anything here int he hills was to a tree vs. house an hour after we had started working. There isnt much around here for them to do apart from USAR if needed and their search fucntion if it was ever needed...

belive u r from stirling?? neway.. if so that would be adelaide hills ses response. they do approx 150-200 tree jobs a year... would you really want to do all that on top of your regular jobs...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on September 14, 2005, 09:11:56 AM
that would be adelaide hills ses response. they do approx 150-200 tree jobs a year... would you really want to do all that on top of your regular jobs...
Wouldn't that only be if Stirling was covering the entire area that Adelaide hills SES covers, which probably includes more than 20 brigades? :wink:
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on September 14, 2005, 09:14:19 AM
Yes, good point, they do cover a large area, hence the number of calls.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on September 14, 2005, 09:31:47 AM
Reporting is also different.

I am aware of a number of SES units who when out doing flooding/storm damage that record every new address/house, premises as a new job.

Mmmmmmm if that were the case the other year with the Pat flooding we would have done 20+ jobs and then the next day or two with trees down another 20+ jobs, not to mention the neighbouring brigades who were also busy, plus we have an SES unit, just north of us and also just south!!!!!

Imagine then Murray Bridge CFS call numbers - they outnumber SES 6 to 1 for the past 2 Murray Briddge floods and on average were going from house to house every 15 - 30 minutes for a day and a half!!!
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on September 14, 2005, 09:33:44 AM
firetruck, do you know the call stats for the local SES brigades / stations / units (Whatever they are called)?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on September 14, 2005, 11:04:18 AM
SES also record ALL taskings not just incidents.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 14, 2005, 09:02:08 PM
Reporting is also different.

I am aware of a number of SES units who when out doing flooding/storm damage that record every new address/house, premises as a new job.


which is exactly what you should be doing to prove that you attended that job later down the track...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 14, 2005, 09:04:44 PM
firetruck, do you know the call stats for the local SES brigades / stations / units (Whatever they are called)?

Units

unfortunatley SES call stats are unavailable to the public unless the unit chooses to do something like sturt (www.sturtrescue.com.au) and post them somewhere... however i have maes in various units, hwo chat to me about it sometimes. (i wont incriminate them too LOL)
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on September 15, 2005, 09:02:15 AM
which is exactly what you should be doing to prove that you attended that job later down the track...
Quote

We have traditionallly recorded all of the addresses in the brigade occuance book and put it down as one call, multiple locations.

However if you report every address as a call it explains why your call rate has gone up so much  - thought it was just coz you were now in sturt group and Bwd south lol  :evil: :evil: :evil:
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: mattb on September 15, 2005, 11:00:50 AM
Interestingly we queried this point a couple of weeks ago after two significant storm damage nights. We have been told by someone involved in Operations Planning (HQ) that if you attend multiple houses in the same street then they all go down as one incident, if however you attend one house in five streets then that goes down as five seperate incidents. If in doubt ring the regional office (or ask your Group Officer and let him chase it up) to clarify.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on September 15, 2005, 12:22:05 PM
I agree.

The Natural Disaster/Storm Damage 'incident' should go down as one job. (I.e - 6 Houses in the same street, are one incident, multiple locations / wide spread damage).  As in all fairness you did not do 6 seperate jobs.

However, if you responded on that night to 3 suburbs, and 8 houses in different streets, then it should go down as a seperate job.

This could explain why SES look like they do 1200 calls a year....  It maybe that they did 250 calls, but counted each task in the call as a seperate job.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 15, 2005, 10:46:54 PM
as a matter of fatc, all tree jobs we have done lately (large storm dmagae "nights") have been diff streets, etc.. so yeh, by ur method would be a seperate incident each time, however.... every seperate incident/adress should be a new incident report to SOC, because they need to know, and thats, that.
call rate going up because we are sturt group.... umm righto, so basically you think our call rate will go up because we now cover a smaller area than when we were responding with happy valley??
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: TillerMan on September 16, 2005, 11:22:44 AM
Yes every street number needs to be on a fire report for insurance purposes. Not sure if you can put multiple numbers on 1 fire report, maybe something to look into.
eg. if an insurance company rings cfs about a job and cfs can't say whether they actually went to that particular house or not there could be some issues with pay outs etc.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on September 16, 2005, 11:30:15 AM
Thats right, I think a report should be done for everything, but I guess a way around it is to list in the occurence book each property visited because the occurence book can be submitted as evidence.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: corocfs on September 16, 2005, 11:31:04 PM
thanks for the backup tillerman...

what i am saying is sure if you attend a street that has mutliple trees down ON THE ROAD, this would be one incident as far as i and my brigade are concerned... however multiple trees down on multiple homes/structures, these are seperate incidents attended, to prove we actually attended and assisted.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on September 20, 2005, 12:14:05 AM
firetruck, do you know the call stats for the local SES brigades / stations / units (Whatever they are called)?

They sent the job numbers to all SES Units just the other week for the last financial year. I will see if i can get my hands on it and post the numbers.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on September 20, 2005, 12:59:51 AM
Cheers B2, should be very interesting :)
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on September 20, 2005, 11:51:35 PM
Sorry guys, you will have to give me an extra week. We had a job tonight and forgot all about the job numbers til I was driving home.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on September 21, 2005, 12:19:29 AM
We had a job tonight and forgot all about the job numbers til I was driving home.

Was that the Car vs House at Bridgewater?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on September 22, 2005, 02:05:36 AM
Thats the one. Did it look good on TV?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on September 22, 2005, 02:19:02 AM
I didn't see it on TV, I was on the initial Rescue response. ;) If anyone has Photos, it'd be nice if you could start a new thread and post them, as it sounded like an interesting job... :)
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on September 22, 2005, 02:28:02 AM
I will try and get my hands on those too. Or at least a CD that I can send to your station.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on September 23, 2005, 07:35:07 AM
yep it looked very good on TV mind you all you could see was the car and house and not the emergency service guys working???
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Chatty on September 23, 2005, 09:32:54 AM
You could see myself and another SES member on Channel 7 - dunno about Channel 9
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Chatty on September 23, 2005, 09:42:17 AM
Ok, let’s establish some basics here:

1 – SES and CFS are here for the one purpose – to serve our communities and provide them with the best damn emergency service we can

2 – CFS is primarily a fire-fighting organisation – sure they do some RCR and other things, but the name says it all – Country FIRE Service

3 – SES is primarily a rescue organisation – and we do a lot of other things, as the name says - State EMERGENCY Service

As far as the counting of incidents goes – I cannot remember ever attending multiple incidents in the one street, except for a couple of occasions where one tree has nuked two houses – that counts as one job.  So, our incidents are invariably all over the place, and when major storms hit the Adelaide Hills it is not unusual for our vehicles to rack up 500km each over a period of two or so days.  Each job counts as one incident in those circumstances.

Where one tasking extends over more than 24 hours, each day is written up as a separate incident, as that accurately represents the change-of-shift which with CFS would be accomplished by calling in another brigade.

Using the above criteria, Adelaide Hills SES attended 205 incidents last financial year, for a total of 4080 man hours and 13,857 km travelled.
A break-up of the incidents gives the following stats:

Animal Rescue          3 occasions
Storm Damage         151 occasions
     Wind                 98 occasions
     Flooding                 53 occasions
Powerlines         12 occasions
Community Service     40 occasions
Public relations      15 occasions
Communications         3 occasions
Evacuations            4 occasions
Fire Support         22 occasions
Hazards present         65 occasions
   
Traffic Control         29 occasions
Emergency Ops Centre  16 occasions
Transport         19 occasions
Vehicle Entry          1 occasions

And yes, I know that when you add them up, it adds up to more than 205 – that’s because some jobs have multiple components…
These 205 jobs were managed with two vehicles – a “light rescue” Ford Courier 4WD and a “medium rescue” Mitsubishi Canter 2WD, both of which are well and truly past their use-by date!

We have over the last 12 months also provided base camp support to CFS at both the Eyre Peninsula and Kangaroo Island fires – a role we are both happy and proud to undertake.

Adelaide Hills SES covers an area of around 1,000 square kilometres, ranging from Callington in the east, Meadows in the south, Harrogate / Woodside / Basket Range / Piccadilly / Summertown in the north and Mylor / Aldgate / Stirling / Crafers / Bridgewater to the west.
And for the record, Adelaide Hills SES is the only non-metropolitan SES Unit that does not have a road crash capability.  In fact, we don’t even have any powered hydraulic gear – only a very ancient set of hand-pumped gear.

Much has been said of our response times.  For the record, in the last 24 months there have been TWO occasions where the Unit took longer than 10 minutes to respond to an incident page, and neither job was a life-threat situation.  Our typical “out-the-door” response time for a life-threat incident is less than 5 minutes and less 10 minutes for storm damage and the like.  Because of our area of coverage we have to travel long distances to some jobs (especially those on our boundaries) and that adds to the time it takes us to actually get to a job.

Added to this is that, until recently, CFS responded to virtually everything “lights and sirens” - SES very rarely did.  We now have new guidelines that enable us to respond to more things as Priority 1 or 2.

What particularly irks me is that on a couple of occasions we have been accused of taking an hour or more to respond to a request from CFS for assistance.  I am more than willing to share our records with anyone, and what they will show is that on those jobs the CFS person responsible (no name, no pack drill) for calling us has waited an hour or more to actually place the call, and then gone back to their CFS members and said “Oh, I called SES an hour ago, I don’t know where they have got to…”

Play safe people

Chatty
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: TillerMan on September 23, 2005, 10:50:11 AM
I think you guy's do a great job in time's of bad weather. Our brigade usually does 4 to 10 jobs at once in bad weather and they are usually pretty minor then we go home but we hear you guy's out there for day's after us.

I am surprised you don't hand ball more job's to us to take the pressure off a bit........ I don't know about the other guy's on here but I wouldn't mind if we cut up a few more tree's on bad night's seeing as we are usually at our station's or out at jobs anyway.

I notice you put public relations down as a job, normally for us that would be on an "other activity" form otherwise we would all do 500 jobs a year.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Chatty on September 23, 2005, 11:03:19 AM
When we say "public relations" and "community service" we are talking about things like the Christmas Pageant (6+ hours), the Royal Show (this year 5 days of 14 hours each for our Unit) and other time-consuming efforts - I don't have a problem as racking them up as jobs, and our reporting system specifically requires that we do.

As for calling you guys in to help - that has been a problem in the Hills due to the traditionally poor relationship between CFS and SES.  A couple of us (from each service) have been working on solving that problem and I think you'll notice more inter-service cooperation happening in the future.
But we also start getting into issues of equipment levels and training - we are much better prepared than the average CFS Brigade to deal with storm and rescue jobs.  For trees alone we have 7 chainsaws and 2 pole saws...

And I have to say I feel guilty about calling CFS in on wet nights when you don't have wet weather gear and we do

Chatty
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on September 23, 2005, 01:46:55 PM
yes SES do a great job, i was able to see this first hand while offering help the other day at a nasty mva just out of dartmoor. I think sometimes we never fully understand what ses or cfs or mfs really do unless you see them at work first hand. I  have no problem if they want to hand ball some work to cfs when they are busy as long as we have trainned people to use chainsaws...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: TillerMan on September 23, 2005, 02:18:15 PM
Maybe more training officers need to organise more inter service training so that we can compare equipment and get used to some of the SES members and controllers so that we're not scared to call each other out.
It goes both ways, SES wouldn't realize half of the gear a fire truck has to carry and we wouldn't realize half of the gear an SES rescue truck carry's.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on September 23, 2005, 04:29:08 PM
Chatty - good post.

I guess when you feel that someone has had a go at you relax - you are from one SES unit and there are a few and many don't have the repsonse times that you have - but hey all services are in the same boat, there are CFS, MFS and SAAS stations that can't always meet their  'nominated' response times!

As for passing off jobs - wet weather gear is a poor excuse - we are a fire service, we use water every day and we are used to getting wet!!!
At the end of the day it must always come back to service to the community - why delay a response to someones request just because you need to use another service!

As for the only non metropolitan unit not to have RCR - there are many that are have it, that are second recuse and hence rarely if ever use it, so don't feel left out!
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on September 23, 2005, 05:31:29 PM
Thanks for your post Chatty... Its always good to hear what you really do from someone who does it... As oz fire said, I don't think anyone was having a go at the SES, we all appreciate what you do...

2 – CFS is primarily a fire-fighting organisation – sure they do some RCR and other things, but the name says it all – Country FIRE Service

I think this is one of the major problems the CFS is facing... Yes, most of the brigades (especially rural) only do fire, but there are a large number that are also rescue and HAZMAT. Most of the Adelaide hills have a rescue brigade in close proximity, and CFS rescue isn't just an omnitool, and bolt cutters, but a professional service (At least thats what we like to think :lol:). Most brigades in Lofty Group are responding to as many MVA's as we are to going rural fires... But the public still see us as a fire service, rather than what we really do...
Also, the MFS (Metro FIRE Service) do far more than just fires... If we just responded to fires, then we could ask why the SES is responding to a tree down with no threat to life, its not an Emergency... :wink:

What particularly irks me is that on a couple of occasions we have been accused of taking an hour or more to respond to a request from CFS for assistance. I am more than willing to share our records with anyone, and what they will show is that on those jobs the CFS person responsible (no name, no pack drill) for calling us has waited an hour or more to actually place the call, and then gone back to their CFS members and said “Oh, I called SES an hour ago, I don’t know where they have got to…”

I suspect these incidents occur when you are already at a job, and we were placed in a queue... This happens a lot with SAPOL, if they already have another incident more important than yours, you can call all you like, but they won't come any faster...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on September 23, 2005, 07:58:51 PM
I suspect these incidents occur when you are already at a job, and we were placed in a queue... This happens a lot with SAPOL, if they already have another incident more important than yours, you can call all you like, but they won't come any faster...

Not always. I can think of one job we had, I heard the CFS brigade ask for us to attend over a scanner while I was just leaving the city. We received the page for the job just as I entered Mt Barker so about 30 min delay. We had no other tasks that day, and from memory there wasnt any other CFS brigades talking on the GRN for that period so I assume it was a quite day for all.

Some days things just get lost in communication I guess..
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: kat on September 28, 2005, 07:49:04 PM
Ah, no such thing as "some RCR".

We do RCR :-)

Good to read your informative, "chatty" post. Thanks. And that's one small SES member in your avatar ;-)
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on September 29, 2005, 12:28:52 AM
Chatty - I disagree with the comment about being primarily the ' Country FIRE Service.  Either you are mis-informed of really have little knowledge in that area.  And the comment about a little rescue.. Thats bollocks!  - I think if it was all TOTALLED up, across the state, CFS would attend and operate at more RCR jobs that SES.

Secondly, we could go on all day about times when SES could have called CFS, and visa versa...Instead lets think about ways it can be fixed... 
(Eg, when i heard the SES the other day arriving at an incident, giving it a priority, and moving to the next.. Should they have called the CFS to attend it?? Should SOC have jumped in and said "you are in CFS area, how about while you go to the next one to give it a priority, they handle that..??)

Who knows... So many posibilities of what could / should / would be done...  Lets try fixing them!
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Mike on October 04, 2005, 12:07:45 PM
CFS and SES cover the SAME areas Striker... so the only argument about those imaginary boundaries would be with other SES units in Chatty's case.

Lets not waste time on who goes to more of what..... if your that interested... ask for the numbers! the info is available.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on October 06, 2005, 10:30:08 AM
Ah, no such thing as "some RCR".

We do RCR :-)

What was meant Kat was that while CFS do RCR in some parts of the state, SES do it in other parts. I had a quick look but I couldn't find the total number of RCR jobs the CFS attended last financial year, but the SES had 720 RCR jobs.

State wide our top 3 jobs are Wind/Storm (1763 jobs), Flooding (944) and RCR (720). SES also assisted CFS in Fire Ops 161 times.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: kat on October 06, 2005, 11:14:25 AM
The CFS attended 1686 motor vehicle accident incidents in  2002/2003 from the annual report (sorry not to be more recent but the 03/04 link from the CFS web page resulted in the .pdf version of the 02/03 report which took so long to come up that I didn't have the heart to try the 02/03 link and see if it yielded the 03/04 report)

This is incidents, not Brigade turnouts.

The total of incidents attended for 02/03 was given as 8079 with 13518 brigade responses.

I guess like us the 720 RCR jobs you've quoted included any motor vehicle accident whether actual extrication involving rescue equipment was needed. From our 1686 MVA incidents attended in 02/03, 191 were listed as "rescue".
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on October 06, 2005, 01:26:44 PM
Oh yeah there is no way that 720 jobs were cuts outs otherwise we would be one of the worst places in the world to drive a car!!
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on October 06, 2005, 04:59:34 PM
I couldn't tell you how many of those 720 were 'cut outs' our annual incident sheet just lists it as Road Accident Rescue.

But the point is still the same, the fire service (MFS/CFS) is not the only RCR provider in the State.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on October 06, 2005, 05:29:24 PM
B2 that is a huge urban myth and generalisation - get outside of the greater adelaide area and into the rest of this huge state and the communities are aware who provides the services, also unlike those in the big smoke, although they know who does it, most don't care who it is, they are greatful that people from their community undertake the task, regardless of uniform or service.

Maybe the Adelaide perception for RCR is because the Fire Services are the only providers in the Greater Adelaide area (which includes the surrounding suburban masses and most of SA's population) - I'm guessing Yankalilla or Murray Bridge would be the closest RCR teams to Adelaide with a primary RCR response????
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on October 06, 2005, 05:33:15 PM
Well SAPOL are actually still the combatant authority for vehicle accidents in this state.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: kat on October 07, 2005, 02:11:05 PM
In the areas we serve I think the reverse is actually true. The public perception is that the CFS does bushfires and nothing else. They believe SES does all rescue.

Murray Bridge MFS has very limted rescue capabilities and is only the town response. Murray Bridge SES do all the surrounding areas (ie freeway) and therefore the lions share of rescue in that area.

Tailem Bend CFS covers 1st rescue halfway to MB, halfway to Coonalpyn (CFS Rescue), halfway to Meningie (SES Rescue), halfway to Karoonda (CFS Rescue) and halfway to Lameroo (CFS Rescue) (over 50km). But most of the people in this area would not generally be aware CFS does rescue.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: OMGWTF on October 09, 2005, 01:50:25 AM
murray bridge SES is actually the RCR response to all MVAs in and around murray bridge, MFS in murray bridge are not a rescue resource as per the directory (look it up youll be amazed at how many retained MFS either arent rcr resources at all or are dual-response)

does anyone else get the perception from this thread of;

"mines bigger than yours!!!" "no mines bigger.." "no mine is..." "no mine."
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: JamesGar on October 09, 2005, 08:47:26 AM
Quote
Maybe the Adelaide perception for RCR is because the Fire Services are the only providers in the Greater Adelaide area (which includes the surrounding suburban masses and most of SA's population) - I'm guessing Yankalilla or Murray Bridge would be the closest RCR teams to Adelaide with a primary RCR response?

CFS still is combatant for RCR in Yankalilla area. South Coast from Port Elliot has SES in the role.

Also SAPOL is the commanding authority for Vehicle related incidents (not vehicle fires though) but SES/MFS/CFS is the combatant authority.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on October 09, 2005, 11:08:06 PM
murray bridge SES is actually the RCR response to all MVAs in and around murray bridge, MFS in murray bridge are not a rescue resource as per the directory (look it up youll be amazed at how many retained MFS either arent rcr resources at all or are dual-response)

does anyone else get the perception from this thread of;

"mines bigger than yours!!!" "no mines bigger.." "no mine is..." "no mine."

hahaha...



Im still trying to work out what the SES does... ??




:P
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: OMGWTF on October 09, 2005, 11:37:45 PM
at the end of the day im sure they do a hell of a lot more jobs than us (in relation to the number of stations they have), but sure.. they do differant stuff to us, it is equally as important for them to exist as it is for us too..
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Mike on October 10, 2005, 10:10:06 AM
Quote
they do differant stuff to us, it is equally as important for them to exist as it is for us too..

Well said  :-D
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: OMGWTF on October 10, 2005, 12:36:49 PM
Im still trying to work out what the SES does... ??

ok.. im a member of the cfs but this si my understanding, im sure chatty or B2 can add to this:

the ses does:

storm damage (trees, flooding, roofs flapping)
landsearch
vertical rescue
confined space rescue (in places)
vehicle accident rescue
urban search and rescue
structural stailisation jobs (im sure theres a better name for that)
marine rescue (in places)
lighting at crime scenes
shelter at crime scens etc..
assist in evacuating people during floods, fires, etc..
assist other services (SAAS with patient lifts, etc..)
animal rescues

etc etc etc...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Robert-Robert34 on October 10, 2005, 02:03:11 PM
The SES does all those tasks but it's very hard to get into the State Emergency Service if you live 20-25 mintues away from one as i've tried to join the SES during winter but have had my applications rejected because of response time from Kalangadoo to Millicent

Im hoping that my latest letter to the SES gets me a sub base membership so i can respond to emergencies around the Kalangadoo township which my brigade dont get paged to
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on October 10, 2005, 02:13:33 PM
Im still trying to work out what the SES does... ??

ok.. im a member of the cfs but this si my understanding, im sure chatty or B2 can add to this:

the ses does:

storm damage (trees, flooding, roofs flapping)
landsearch
vertical rescue
confined space rescue (in places)
vehicle accident rescue
urban search and rescue
structural stailisation jobs (im sure theres a better name for that)
marine rescue (in places)
lighting at crime scenes
shelter at crime scens etc..
assist in evacuating people during floods, fires, etc..
assist other services (SAAS with patient lifts, etc..)
animal rescues

etc etc etc...

I was being a smart *** .

As you were with the MFS wannabe's comment in another thread..
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: OMGWTF on October 11, 2005, 09:15:52 AM
:-D
nothin wrong with that
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Chatty on October 11, 2005, 11:33:39 AM
Sorry folks, been a bit busy lately with job interviews and such - but some interesting posts recently.

Yes, both organisation's names lead to problems - fire isn't the only thing CFS (or MFS) do - and "emergency" is just so vague...
That's why David Place is re-branding SES as "SES RESCUE" to emphasise our rescue role.

Interestingly, David flagged in a recent newspaper article that he can see a time in the not too distant future when the public won't perceive separate agencies - they will just perceive one big emergency/fire/rescue/search/USAR/whatever organisation...

There is a tendency to get get caught up in the mine is bigger than yours syndrome - it's a really good reason why there should be more cooperative training exercises between the services!
And yeah - I bet that most SES/CFS members don't know what is on the average vehicle from the other service.

What I was trying to get at with the name thing is that SES don't do fires (that's why we have a CFS) and CFS don't do "emergencies" - in terms of things like search, USAR, vertical rescue, etc.

I think there is too much of a tendency to badge RCR as "real" rescue and everything else as just playing games.  For my money, crawling through a collapsed structure (or a cave) looking for casualties is one of the scariest things you will ever do gives you a whole new perspective on rescue.

Much as I like RCR, if I never have to cut another screaming kid (or adult) out of a car I wouldn't be too upset.

Something that I didn't convey well is that the two services complement each other and can work together well if some people swallow their egos and try to get along - and those people are in both services!

As far as RCR goes, I personally think that in the Adelaide Hills the current system where CFS provide second response to CFS is shortsighted and asking for trouble as there will come a time when the CFS will be fully involved in fire fighting (the Hills is ready and waiting for another fire disaster) and a road crash will happen.  The only choice will be to pull fire fighting resources out of that battle to attend the road crash.  Wouldn't it make a whole lot more sense for SES (who can't fight fires) to attend the RCR in those circumstances?

So, for my money, lets work towards CFS backing up SES when they can, and SES backing up CFS when the brown stuff hits the rotating blades - that's why I would like to see my SES Unit develop an RCR capability.

Play safe people

Chatty
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Chatty on October 11, 2005, 11:40:57 AM
Just a couple more thoughts...

Yep, the little tacker in the pic would have to qualify as our youngest member - he's the son of one of my female members (who lives, breathes, drinks and eats SES) and I couldn't resist hijacking the photo
William is also my "adopted" grandson...

As for the bloke who had his application rejected from SES because he lives too far away - that decision would have been made at a Unit level.
I have members who live 30+ minutes away - as well as quite a few who are 15 or so minutes away - and they form my "second response" team.

The idea is that my closest members get to the Unit first, respond with one vehicle and get to the scene.  The second responders can then either back them up with a second vehicle and/or additional people or are able to attend any subsequent jobs that may come in.  This has worked well as quite often the first team will get to a job and find it's not what we were told and will get the second team to bring additional equipment or whatever with them.
And how many times have we had one job come in to be followed by a second while we are still travelling to the first?

Be safe people

Chatty
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on October 11, 2005, 12:03:53 PM
I think their are a couple of CFS brigades that do the "emergencies" such as Vertical Rescue training.  I think stirling have some vert. rescue equipment and I thought naracoorte did also, can you confirm Blinky.. ?



At the end of the day, no matter what each service does, it comes down to needing the help at the big jobs...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: CFS_Firey on October 11, 2005, 01:12:41 PM
As far as RCR goes, I personally think that in the Adelaide Hills the current system where CFS provide second response to CFS is shortsighted and asking for trouble as there will come a time when the CFS will be fully involved in fire fighting (the Hills is ready and waiting for another fire disaster) and a road crash will happen. The only choice will be to pull fire fighting resources out of that battle to attend the road crash. Wouldn't it make a whole lot more sense for SES (who can't fight fires) to attend the RCR in those circumstances?

So, for my money, lets work towards CFS backing up SES when they can, and SES backing up CFS when the brown stuff hits the rotating blades - that's why I would like to see my SES Unit develop an RCR capability.

Play safe people

Chatty

I can't speak for all other RCR brigades, but I know that Stirling is still able to respond to an RCR during a bushfire, our Rescue gear is on our Rescue truck (Which doesn't go to fires) and we have an Omnitool on our pumper, which usually doesn't go to bushfires either...

However, I completely agree that there should be more cooperation between SES and CFS, it would be good to do some joint training and find out more about the other service, and maybe evenset up some SOP's on when the SES should be or can be responded...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: OMGWTF on October 11, 2005, 02:20:59 PM
I was at a house fire the other day where both group rescue resources were tied up... and i mean tied up as in hose lines off, and plumbed in to hydrants..

up heres for thinking
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on October 11, 2005, 03:00:26 PM
As far as RCR goes, I personally think that in the Adelaide Hills the current system where CFS provide second response to CFS is shortsighted and asking for trouble as there will come a time when the CFS will be fully involved in fire fighting (the Hills is ready and waiting for another fire disaster) and a road crash will happen.  The only choice will be to pull fire fighting resources out of that battle to attend the road crash.  Wouldn't it make a whole lot more sense for SES (who can't fight fires) to attend the RCR in those circumstances?

Chatty - fair call, however CFS brigades and Groups, have for years followed brigade and group response plans. In many, many areas across the hills and state, there are already written plans to cover such events - occasionally an appliance carrying RCR equipment will be involved in fire fighting operations, however the system allows for back up and alike to occur or a switched on OIC will ensure, should the need arise they can be released.

Again - if we we in a well to do state, maybe additional rescue equipment could be purchased, for that one if twenty years - what if. Practices (current best practice) is deal with the incident you have, not the what if's otherwise CFS would have alot more appliances, equipment and alike and would probably also have vertical rescue, USAR etc for that just in case an incident should occur when SES have storms and flooding and 200 jobs qued up waiting!

Again only my opinion, but there is already alot of duplication and as a tax payer and frequent responder my money could be better spend in other areas - new vehicles, updating old equipment, training, prevention, mitigation ... the list goes on and on and on!
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: oz fire on October 11, 2005, 03:16:21 PM
Re USAR - Maybe heres the answer we should all read...... it speaks for its self!

It appears our brothers interstae have it all wrapped up and in hand - no arguing here who has the role, both at home and abroad!


Message from NSWFB Commissioner Greg Mullins - Dated Monday - October 10.

"Following the weekend earthquake, the Government of Pakistan requested international assistance for disaster relief. A number of Governments dispatched Urban Search & Rescue (USAR) teams under bi-lateral arrangements that they had in place with the Pakistani Government.
 
On Sunday and today, as the national contact-person for USAR response, I have been in discussions with the Director General of Emergency Management Australia (EMA), the Commissioner of the Queensland Fire & Rescue Service (which at present is on-call for international USAR response), and the Director General of the Queensland Emergency Services Bureau.
 
At the same time, the Rescue Section and EMA monitored requests from the United Nations' Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) via the web-based "Virtual On-site Coordination Centre" (OSOCC). As of yesterday morning, the situation was as follows:
 
*  There had been no direct request to the Australian Govt for USAR support
 
*  A number of other countries including the UK, China, Japan, Turkey and Estonia had dispatched USAR teams to Pakistan to assist, and the Pakistani and Indian military were engaged in rescue / relief operations.
 
*  There are very significant logistical challenges, as roads, communication and other infrastructure have been severely damaged.
 
*  There is a significant need for food, clothing, medicine, water, shelter, and heavy-lift helicopters capable of working at high altitudes.
 
This morning, the UN reported on the OSOCC that no further rescue assistance is required. The Australian Government has focussed its efforts on providing humanitarian aid including water purification, food, and medicine. It is now highly unlikely that there will be an Australian USAR response, and if there is, it will be from the on-call (Qld) team. The NSWFB and QFRS, as the two international response task forces, work on a rotation basis.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on October 11, 2005, 04:55:41 PM
I saw on the news a USAR team from the UK extricating a small child from the rubble.  Believe the only way they managed to get to the scene was by Helicopter due to critical infastructure being destroyed in the quake.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on October 24, 2005, 04:53:39 PM
Sorry, but I think you need to have a good hard look at how you operate before even thinking of being RCR, the RCR directory is set out to cater for these events. The only RCR within miles of Mt Barker that is not on a dedicated RCR appliance is Meadows, every other brigade has a dedicated rescue. You would not be able to cover an area any bigger than Mt Barker due to the fact your response times wouldn't allow it. So really, there isn't any point trying, the whole idea is to rationlise resources, not create more.

There is such a high concentration of RCR in the hills as it is that I really think adding another one into the picture would be a bit of overkill. Also, if your not in the RCR directory, then you don't exist as far as being turned out goes, and you have buckleys and none chance of getting in that book. You are not a recognised resource if your not in that green book, so there is a whole lot more to it than just getting some gear and going cutting when the fire service is a bit low on trucks.
You would have to be permenant 2nd rescue to ever be turned out.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on October 24, 2005, 08:30:48 PM
Naracoorte rescue has verticale rescue gear aswell as cave rescue our guys did a rope rescue course last year(some of our new members) and we are a stand alone rescue/hazmat no pump,no water as the name says RESCUE and that is the way we like it as we are often out of town for long periods.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on October 25, 2005, 12:29:22 AM
Thanks for clearing that up blinky...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Robert on October 25, 2005, 12:32:44 PM
Im still trying to work out what the SES does... ??

ok.. im a member of the cfs but this si my understanding, im sure chatty or B2 can add to this:

the ses does:

storm damage (trees, flooding, roofs flapping)
landsearch
vertical rescue
confined space rescue (in places)
vehicle accident rescue
urban search and rescue
structural stailisation jobs (im sure theres a better name for that)
marine rescue (in places)
lighting at crime scenes
shelter at crime scens etc..
assist in evacuating people during floods, fires, etc..
assist other services (SAAS with patient lifts, etc..)
animal rescues

So as a tax payer why do we need a Adelaide Hills SES- CFS already do all this in the hills (+ more)  and we have a lot more man power (15+ stations) and  much quicker response times  then just one SES unit- why double your services Both services are only volunteers and most cases CFS get called to most SES jobs in the Hills
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Mike on October 25, 2005, 12:56:34 PM
Robert.....

How often do CFS train in Verical? marine rescue? landsearch? sand bagging? storm damage operations?

CFS train in their core business generally, likewise SES in theirs....
and both services need each others help.

For the record, Ive seen SES beat CFS to calls on quite a few occasions to, so dont be to quick to judge.

The following link contains discussion on combining of the services:

http://www.safirefighter.com/index.php?option=com_smf&Itemid=53&topic=214.0
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Wagon 1 on October 27, 2005, 07:07:07 PM
Ha, there's a good point Mike, we are trying to run multiple services in smallish towns, so whilst the SES rescue gets out, you are then putting the CFS in jeapordy by taking crews and vice versa, we can't run multiple services with limited people. I hate to say it, but you are never going to close the fire service, some sort of amalgamation otherwise all of us will continue to struggle, and it might stop all the carry on that happens now. You can't argue with yourself (well some do)!!

My experience is from an urban point of view, and its just a fact of life that SES recruit from a much larger area so its just a simple fact that they will take longer, you can't do anything about it, we in CFS or MFS are only able to recruit from such a limited area that we are used to quick urgent response times, its just a culture thing, those SES that are rescue are often recruiting people that wear 2 hats, so they are going to be a lot quicker.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Robert-Robert34 on October 27, 2005, 07:29:22 PM
Thats very true David the SES often recruit a person who is wearing 2 hats but it's harder for us firies to become members of the SES so we have something to do during the off season 

Believe me i have tried about 2 or 3 times to join the SES but have had my application rejected just because i wear a cap which has a red and yellow SA State Logo with CFS printed in the middle

Why cant the CFS & SES in rural South Australia just get along with each other like their city relatives do as this silly cross service rivalry has gone on for long enough and should stop
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: OMGWTF on October 27, 2005, 07:55:56 PM

Believe me i have tried about 2 or 3 times to join the SES but have had my application rejected just because i wear a cap which has a red and yellow SA State Logo with CFS printed in the middle


bullshit robert.

you cant get in becasue you obviously live to far away... if anything the rivalry between CFS/SES in country areas is less than urban areas.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Robert-Robert34 on October 27, 2005, 09:30:09 PM
Thats true OMGWTF i do live abit far away from any SES unit but the main reason i want to join is because Kalangadoo is a non RCR brigade and very rarely get's called out during winter

We could say that the rivalry between CFS & SES in both rural and urban South Australia is 50/50 but still i think it's abit silly for these 2 services to have a rivalry just because of a clash of who gets paged first to an emergency and who gets paged second as well as the uniforms being of similar colour
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on October 28, 2005, 08:15:03 AM
Robert,is there a need for you to join ses? also you have good RCR cover from Penola and millicent and then the SES so why would you want to join. Its also a long drive from doo to millicent to get on the SES appliances. Be happy with the service that you are in and may be get your brigade more involved in community education if your not doing alot now.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: OMGWTF on October 28, 2005, 09:08:19 AM
believe roebrt is saying he wants to join SES so he has soemthing to respond to (trees/floods/storms) during the CFSs quieter months..
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: kat on October 28, 2005, 12:08:09 PM
I don't know how (or why) we would monitor CFS/SES rivalry and who has more, urban or rural. From my (limited) observations there are Units/Brigades who work extremely closely with many dual members and get along great. (Some of these are even asking, why not amalgamate?). Then I have seen intense, damaging, horrendous rivalry (yes, in rural areas) that has even jeopordised operations. I do know of an SES Unit that would not allow CFS members to join because they believed there would be a conflict. Not that this necessarily has anything to do with rivalry, I have also heard of SAAS being extra wary taking on fire service members because of availability/hard to serve two emergency services type thing.
I have also seen the same kind of damaging rivalry between Brigades in our own service.

Thankfully there are more and more of us on board whose main aim is to protect life and property from fire and other emergencies and have no time for petty rivalries.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Robert-Robert34 on October 28, 2005, 01:54:14 PM
OMGWTF is right on the money being that Kalangadoo brigade goes to sleep during the winter months when nothing is happening i need to have something to do such as respond to storm damage or land search

As for rivalry between brigades in the CFS kat,Kalangadoo brigade had a rivalry with Nangwarry brigade because we beat the pants off of them in a competition for their CFS trophy shield they a long time ago but now we get along just fine
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: strikeathird on October 28, 2005, 06:00:12 PM
Isn't this about what the S.E.S does.. ??  Not who wants to join a unit, where they live, and various forms of rivalry....

 :?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: rescue5271 on October 29, 2005, 08:31:48 AM
Yes this is about the SES and over the last few days they have been busy and done a great job....
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: bajdas on November 23, 2005, 03:54:19 PM
May I suggest that people have a look at the new websites of www.ses.sa.gov.au or www.sasesva.org.au for details.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: 24P on June 18, 2006, 11:41:05 AM
When the SES are paged for a job do all the unit members get the initial response page? Just saw a call for Sturt SES and a few mins later a message saying "call out pls attend unit" Just curious whether a duty officer or someone else gets the intial page?
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: Benji on June 18, 2006, 12:53:54 PM
Everyone gets the page. I too have wondered why Sturt run it like that. Either its a follow on from before we had teh MFS vetting our jobs or its a way to let everyone know if there is a crew or not. Personally I would hate to be in a meeting or something and have the pager go of 12 times for one job.
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: medevac on June 18, 2006, 08:37:51 PM
im under the impression that the initial page to there alarm channel only goes to a group of duty officers.. who then page the rest of the unit via info adress.... hang over from the old system.

i think they are looking at phasing this out though...
Title: Re: What the SES does
Post by: medevac on June 18, 2006, 08:38:38 PM
just to clarify;

this was only for certain metro units... no road crash units ever had that system...