SA Firefighter

Quote from: PJ on September 17, 2009, 10:44:12 AM
is the map and the proposal available electronicaaly so that it can be posted here for all to see or is this just CJM RC1 wanking on again?

A bit harsh PJ

I hope that the idea flows to the rest of the regions as some of the regions have some group boundaries that just don't make any sense no more. With councils that have amalgamation and the change in funding the old boundtries just don't cut it.

Then again it is the spring horse racing carnival upon us so it would not be surprising some power jockeys have decided to mount up for pleasing their need for control.

Quote from: Zippy on July 22, 2009, 01:38:10 PM
So the conclusion of your post CFS_Firey is: Every able firefighter should have the BA Ticket as part of OHS&W.  Now we know that wont happen till a royal commission tells the CFS to ey...

Zippy I agree with the sentiments of your post and the with SA_Firey. I can see some merit in the having people able to use BA. Considering that I have been to many a structure fire and car fire or refuse fire wear I can't use BA as we don't have BA on the QAV. Using defensive fire fighting techniques to stop the spread of the fire to the neighbours or to other property is good but to those that have lost it all due to a brigade inability to respond properly to a fire that could of been contained to a room or rooms can bring the brigade and service into question by the community it supports.

Quote from: CFS_Firey on July 22, 2009, 02:11:32 PM
Maybe that's why Euan wants to cut the CFS back to an only rural service... ;)

I have and along with the Brigade pushed for CABA to be part of our response but the head set in the service has literally some alternative idealogical plane of thinking. I remember an RC telling members of the  Brigade that sorry you don't deserve BA because your houses burn to quickly. Well they certainly do if it takes nearly an hour for them to get to your town with a CABA appliance. Their assessment of the town that of owing to a lack of two story dwelling and a part time pub, school, service station and a national highway we didn't need CABA. All his information was based on incorrect information.

I remember at a group meeting not so long ago that we had a discussion about reducing the number of sets of CABA in the Group as we had more sets than operators. The main problems is getting to Adelaide or having the entire weekend off for the course which is one of the problems for the CFS. I am a firm believer that like in the SES where SFA is part of the required training so should BA in the CFS (mind you I also believe that SFA should also be part of the BF1  :-) )

I hope that like any of us we all know what is happening in our and neighbouring Brigades - This is by no means an indication of if I am a member of the said Brigade.

Well Alan like most Brigades the information that come to us about our neighbouring Brigades / Groups and  Units can be a bit on the delayed side of things and then we only hear the sanitized versions who knows what else is not known about Iron Knob that could of interest to us.  :-)

Quote from: boredmatrix on July 18, 2009, 09:44:56 PM
fair suck.....2 jobs a year...

Hate tell you they did more than 2 jobs a year! last year according to the promotion unit website they did in 26 (2007/08), 16 (2006/07), 18 (2005/06) and from some inside information in that neck of the woods they are sitting on 22 for the last year.

Quote from: Bagyassfirey on July 18, 2009, 06:35:52 PM
17:55:33 18-07-09 MFS: TRUCK NOW OPERATIONAL- RESTOWED- KEEP REVS ABOVE 1500 RPM AT ALL TIMES CFS Iron Knob Response

hhmmm looks like they didn have the RPM above 1000 at the RCR last night (thought that was common knowledge)

They have only recently got their truck back after nearly killing it it had done on it

fridge mounted on it
new stand pipe brackets
new steps for everywhere on the truck
more reinforcing for the bull bar
new brackets for extinguishers, and fire lighter
two new locker doors from breaking the previous two
having the truck completely rewired
tank volume depth gauge after breaking the last one
a couple of new tyres

I remember on one of the last region 4 composite strike teams one of the strike teams leaders saying from that region that were ever he goes Iron Knob is sure to follow

Oh my what ever a govt and CFS pow wow sitting down and hammering out a new formula. Yes that right it will be a formula that needs a Ph.D to understand let alone work it.

I would much prefer the money go to the Brigade direct rather than through regions so that, the little that is given is not fretted away to become a tube of no more gaps to keep the rain out. If I took a punt I bet there a few Brigades out there that would be able to do just as good if not better job at ensuring the money is spent wisely at maintain the stations. Alas we will also have those that could not be trusted with money as they just don't know when they are being ripped off.

Alan I was under the impression that we are having a deep and meaningful thread about what the CFSVA can do and what they should be doing.

I can send in all types of information that we have submitted to group and region about problems in which the built in environment is the focus that we are meant to inhabit or the short comming in meeting the needs of the community. All this information maybe wonderful and then lets multiple that by all the brigades in the state. The resulting effect is that the poor and only employee of the CFSVA is so over worked at trying to make head and tail along with the relationships between all the data she is given. Even the executive see the tsunami of information and they two feel somewhat overwhelmed by all the information. With the outcome being no action by all.

United is not limited to working together but also includes the doing that work in a coordinated approach. For effective data collection and lobbying have a look at the Kondinin Group very good at effecting change in the agricultural machinery industry by sending out surveys to members that collects data in a standard way and them makes it easy for analysing to produce some very good technical reports.

I remember a little saying about computers garbage in is garbage out: No one wants that to be the case with CFSVA

Hear Hear crashndash

Not that I have problems in the direction that Wayne has described but it is a little a bit nieve to say that we working hand in hand at prompting the government to fund the areas that it is short falling the volunteers. Besides the stories that we all heard or told of our own stations. The government can dismiss all the prompts that the CFSVA put forward with the simple but true line "there is no proof to that".

I can understand that the CFSVA being scarce on the ground but without any concrete data, the CFSVA efforts can only be seen as media grabs with some shock value that have a short term use by date of a day or two.

I am yet to see a member of the regional CFSVA commitee or the state committee turnup on the door step to look in side the brigade that I am from.

I can't see why the various volunteer ESO can't join or amalgamate or form allegiances to act as one. Trade unions have done it i.e. what do forestry workers and manufacture workers have in common? Answer they share the same union.

Meeting are fine but the CFS "meeting out" people when you have brigade, group non operational meeting i.e. training or OHS&W or communications and finally operational meetings. The  CFSVA should aim at using other ways of communicating with it members. CFSVA should look at collecting information so that it can argue with facts. Yes the CFSVA has raised awareness of issues in the CFS but the organization needs to have follow through by using data and facts.

I will admit I don't go to CFSVA meetings as I don't see it as practical to drive 200 + km and then back again for our regional CFSVA meeting considering that we don't have a group CFSVA meetings.

Quote from: bajdas on June 25, 2009, 05:59:59 PM
* government building standards
* SFEC
* OHS&W
* australian volunteering standards
* ????? something else ????

To work through your points bajdas government standards are nice but have no legal standing unless they are refereed to by an appropriate piece of legislation. SFEC's; I have just had a look over the CFS 2000 version is a nice document but has no real information as it is too global in classifying the state and lacks the detail. OHS; is the only that the point can be argued due to the range the nature of the issue at hand.

To understand the process that DECS uses for the self administrated audits for OHS please have a look at the following link

http://www.decs.sa.gov.au/ohs/pages/injuryprevention/checklist_w/

It is not a question being average or the timing as in the region that I am from they get done from march through to early may.

The more important thing is that it is being documented a documented that is dated. If you want to change the systems it is no use trying to bring in change but to create that change from the inside using the systems own tools against it.

So SAFECOM has not done an audit on the all the thing they inherited until now. They should change their name to SAFECOMedy to describe their actions  :evil:

Now onto more serious matters I know we all have knocked our respective VA's at some time and that wonderful word has been bandited around "unity". The only people who may have some idea of how good or bad some of the stations may be is Pip and Ashes considering how many of them they have photographed. If I wanted to have an independent advice of how bad things really are; we are faced with two options. The first is hope like madly that the organization that we are lobbying stuffs up the report and gives you the ammo that you are after. The alternative is that you do the hard work yourselves and produce a report of your own.

You have the pictures from the Pip and Ashes we all have contacts in the other brigade who can aid us in self auditing our brigades. Don't laugh as school do it all the time they have downloadable forms. Anyway most Captains should be able to tell you how the regional audit went with your Brigade and what areas needed work. If you just so happen to have a keen as mustard Captain the BOMP maybe already prepared to aid in any SFEC debate that you may wish to have. Overall all the information is out there guys we only have to but it together to get that picture we are so desperately after. Our VA's will be able to assist maybe at organising and the collating the data then analysing it. So as group we have our own ammo not the sanitized version that we are so use to or the anecdotal stories we love to turn into facts.

Chook your example of the cockburn brigade is good one but it needs to be put into correct context. I do know that this is something of an oddity but people want real change in the CFS acting on rumour, Chinese whispers and second hand information will not achieve the desired outcome that we all want to hear.

Cockburn closed due the fact that it was a brigade without sufficient membership. The work that is done of the promotions website particularly on Brigade statistics (yes I do know they are supplied from CFS HQ) does provide a very different picture to who is active and who is not. Hark do I hear you ask why have some brigades have zero hours well those brigade are their own worst emany - All I can say is fill out that paperwork create that paper trail; as all that paper work they try to drown us in can be used to each and every brigade advantage.

As the old adage goes the proof is in the pudding all we have to is add water and stir  :evil:

OUTCOME: To produce those headlines that RescueHazmat imagines

I know the feeling of being the only emergency service around for 80 km and we do what we can. Infact what we do as a rural stowed brigade dose not quite match the work we actually do. come to think of it I am yet to do a rural incident on our home turf yet in the 1 4.

On the concept of confine space training a work collegue of mine who delivers confine space at TAFE would beg to differ on your approach to what confine space rescue is and what it entials.

Being in the more remote parts of SA we should also consider those all important power lines that keep on collecting vegetative samples for crews to remove

Me thinks that fridgey and me are talking about the same brigade.

From talking to a member of the brigade who was told by someone further up the chain that their house burn to quick and having anything better their was a waste of resources. They said they did not consider that a pub, a servo and a school of 35 students with some community infrastructure was worth protecting.

I now that the state a bit tight on the cash but who's going to tell the residents of that town you gonna have to wait for the nearest service to arrive which is a min of 60 k's away. I wonder if they will survive to tell the tale of how it went down.

and what happens if the goals are moved and the the outcome is near  impossible from these health checks

I heard this at a community event that a brigade which leases it building could be closed as the CFS does have the money to either lease a building or construct one. Is the new CFS motto safety first only if it financial viable  :-o

If we audited trainnning and saw how many people who did not train and how many of them are on the trucks would you feel safe  :?

I come from a brigade that trainins we weekly does that mean we are any good at fire fighting who knows this begs the other question what is the quality of that training like I hope that ours is pretty good

That what I heard at the last group meeting that alerts was going to be shutdown and replaced with a new system where only alelaide fire can ring you on alerts for a conferance call. Yes all other detail that you posted are correct

Thank finking sake for that Pip, as we already got a bad enough image as a town with out that hanging over our heads - Mind you I had one CFSVA and an RC flapping about our image problems over this issue which was some what ammusing in a serrious way. I maybe a rebel with out a cuase but I am cerntainly no motorcycle club member

I was contacted by the sunday mail and declined but in hind sight I should of spoken up. Some the items that have been purchased by Brigades in my neck of the woods include, first aid kits, wet weather gear, paint for the station, emergency lighting for the station and getting computer donated to the Brigade.

When I read financial report os of brigade expenaces where it states that nearly $1000 is spent on station mainteance and no sign of it has occured or $450.00 on a fax maichine and the list goes; makes me wonder where the money really goes.

For those of you looking for something closer to home with the actioning of the new bikie laws today what will you do if you have a member of an outlawed motorcycle gang who is already a members of an ESO. Rember your not allowed to be around him more than six times year or you will become an assoicate. Don't forget we can't sack them but I know I will stand by them.

We were issued with ten pager lost two pagers one pager no longer works and has been repaired twice in qucik sucession. We have five members without pagers. Soluation is two pronged send out an sms and have a phone tree going for those with pagers. Yes it is slow but it works

Dear John,

Not comming from one of the regions that is mentioned in the article and being from a region that is a lot like the quote that you posted and having first hand knowledge of the station at Ceduna. Not to bag Ceduna but it is the small town or village brigades that are suffering in the outer regions. Some of the things that I have noticed include the expansion of a group base where the training room is approx 120 sq m and the purchase of an industrial ice machine was done. With Brigades only just down the road with acro props holding the ceiling ups or shoring to stop the wall from collapsing or electrical systems that burn fuses and power point that arc, or water to the station that has the consistency of orange juice sludge.

Yes you are right the fleet is maintained but are the volunteers happy with being treated poorly. Any seasoned volunteer know the frustration that comes from recruiting and retaining members. If the environment is not right then it will see people loose interst they will not attend if is to cold like Pips example. If is not for the volunteers where will the CFS be or do we have enough volunteers in the service and this is the new culling tool being provided for by the govt.

Hear Hear Bill,

The only correction that I I think needs to be made beyond the all ready said SFEC comment is that it not a lack of vision or funding to towards the more urban brigade to the rural brigades rather to the agricultural brigades as some more of the remote brigades are provided with tokens to satisfy them. My brigade questions these norms. As we were only given a last week a branch finally to go the end of our 38's after 10 five years of pushing for it.

Yes we still hold raffles when we can and we do go to public events to raffle a tin to buy things like water as we don't drink the orange sludge that comes out of the taps

I am hoping that the review of the SFEC will produce a document that looks after remote communities whose back up is nearly fifty minutes away.

Robert yes you are right about the pack hike I got that far as well and I thought that at the time I was fit and healthy.

I do have a small correction for you as the national service concept was scuttled as it was too politically hot for some of our polies. Even though the the social good did far out way the hum bug that it create

Again diverting the topic a tad national service was used in the past by other countries to reduce youth unemployment and the effects of recession and depression in the past. Along with infrastructure projects to improve the nation e.g. the snowy mountain scheme.