SA Firefighter
General Discussion => Country Fire Service => Topic started by: uniden on December 29, 2007, 09:12:49 AM
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Have Macclesfield CFS got a new BWC ? Looked like a new tanker in the backround of a photo in a recent edition of `The Courier`. Looked a bit like this one.
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Naracoorte group now has access to a 26,000LT BWC that belongs to the local council in the past we have been able to access a 11,000 and a 17,000 BWC that the council had so the bigger BWC comes at a good time.So far it has been used 3 times this month twice here in our group and did a trip to help CFA at Aplsye at a grass fire.
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Maccy & Mt Gambier are due to get these new BWC's...not sure when it is occurring.....
Pip
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I would say very soon PIP,Gambier BWC is ready to go I guess we will see some movement next week from where it is down to the southeast,not sure where they will put it may be in the new compton station.....
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how many litres is it - doesn't look like many. You guys should look at the Army BWC's, 20000 litres I think, 6x6, will go anywhere. Agree that when full they are over weight but in an emergency who cares?
Or have a look at the trucks civil construction uses for bulk water, same deal.
And is it necessary to build brand new trucks all of the time? Especially when it isn't a front line appliance or is it?
Up here there are plenty of "water carts" around, council, civil construction etc.
Anyway good luck with it, just it looks more like a bulk LPG truck than a water tanker.
cheers
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I believe Maccy already have theirs.
how many litres is it - doesn't look like many. You guys should look at the Army BWC's, 20000 litres I think, 6x6, will go anywhere. Agree that when full they are over weight but in an emergency who cares?
Or have a look at the trucks civil construction uses for bulk water, same deal.
And is it necessary to build brand new trucks all of the time? Especially when it isn't a front line appliance or is it?
Up here there are plenty of "water carts" around, council, civil construction etc.
Anyway good luck with it, just it looks more like a bulk LPG truck than a water tanker.
cheers
They are 13,000 litres hence the call sign BW13. CFS wouldnt want to get involved with overweight trucks. If something goes wrong then you take the can. BTW CFS have built a few tankers on used cab/chasssis like Chaffey, KI group, Lacepede group etc...
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Ok thanks, just it looks a bit small (capacity) and unstable (unusual shape for a liquid tanker), however if you guys reckon it will do the job - sweet!
cheers
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Looks like a freedom transport tank but a little hard to confirm from that pic.
Why wouldnt you build a tanker on a new cab chassis?
You have a truck that will last 20-30 years & can hold 13000 litres compared to a 20 yr old truck that may last 5 or 10 & can only hold 5000-7000 litres.
Also looking at more reliability, easier access to parts, Firefighter comfort & vehicle performance.
Sounds like a win win situation to me. Hopefully the CFS will build alot more of these.
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From what was said to me this is the last large BWC to be built for cfs due to cost which is some what harsh if the information is correct,in a time when water is hard to come by and with appliances having to travel long distances these large BWC are a great way to go. My group is lucky as we have the support of the local council where as some group's here in the southeast dont...
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Thats why the old Hahndorf Pumper,Happy Valley Pumper,Greenhill 32, and Eden Hills Pumper(Ford Louisville) have had the backs taken off them and are getting fitted as BWC's because CFS cant afford new trucks :wink:
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Agree - but will it? New technologies in vehicle design etc. Secondhand Water tankers are on the market for 75k.
How much did this cost?
How often will they be used?
What was the cost benefit analysis? Was there alternatives?
As I said if you guys are happy, fine. However this seems like a reoccurring theme, buy new, have them sit around in sheds for years and then flog them off at a reduced price.
I can see in five years time someone on this forum complaining about "those old water tankers, 14s, 24s, 24ps, 34s, 34ps" and there isn't enough $$ to replace them.
Example - our Toyota Troopy & Holden Rodeo quick response are fairly old, however low ks & in good condition. Yet the members want them replaced, Why because they are not the latest cruiser/ Toyota dual cab ute or Ford F250. They don't have the latest mod cons, they do however have aircon & a FM wireless :-D.
Then I look at our Rescue truck, one of the first in the fleet, less than 40,000 on the clock, a bit under powered (its a 500 not a 550), could do with a bit more useable space in the back. Could we have better - yes the new Victorian Rescue trucks are brilliant- exactly what I would want. Should we have better - no its not cost effective and would be a total waste of tax payers money. Would I accept one if it was issued - my oath!
As I said if you guys are happy - great, however I doubt if everyone will get one if they are all going to be built new on new chassis.
At least you will be able to change the tank onto a new chassis in a few years, that if the tanks don't deteriorate. Remember just cause you don't use something doesn't mean it won't wear out :wink:
Now where is that order form for a new EWP, forklift and oh yeh that front end loader I always wanted :evil:
cheers
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While I can't speak for other areas, the Tankers around my area get used in anger on a regular basis...certainly not sitting around in a shed doing nothing.
There are 4 Tankers in my Group, (ranging from 5000 to 13,000 litres) and it is not uncommon to have all 4 in use at the same time.
They tend not to go off the roads, (and onto fire tracks) due to their size, and the fact they are two wheel drive.
Only one has Airconditioning & the modern niceties (8 years old) ...the others are 18, 23 & 24 years old - but they do the job
Due to the terrain etc, it is generally a slow trip to get to a fill up point & return - so having more several Tanker can be very useful
Recycling of old chassis is not a bad thing BUT CFS is limited in how many old appliances they can convert to Tanker...they are looking for the heavier chassis I think it was the 12.5 tonne chassis and larger - and the vehicle needs to be in reasonable condition mechanically, before being considered for use in a new life as a CFS Tanker.
The availability & cost of parts for the vehicle is also considered, before deciding to use the vehicle.
The chassis mentioned in another post have been sitting around for some time - I'm not sure if a decision has actually been made as to the whether they will be converted to Tankers or not...
Pip
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Ok thanks Pip - as long as they are cost effective :wink:
cheers
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When the old Kalangadoo 34 was put out of commission after 20 years service it was converted into a water tanker and is being used by a construction company in Adelaide although i think it would have made a really good BWC for the CFS
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The chassis mentioned in another post have been sitting around for some time - I'm not sure if a decision has actually been made as to the whether they will be converted to Tankers or not...
Pip
Ive been told that the tender has gone out for the conversions :wink:
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At least you will be able to change the tank onto a new chassis in a few years, that if the tanks don't deteriorate. Remember just cause you don't use something doesn't mean it won't wear out :wink:
Dont count on that.....seen a tanker with one of those tanks on it..less than a year old and already leaking like a sive.
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Yeh...quality parts lol :|
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Yeh...quality parts lol :|
Cheap Fire Service :roll:
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Ah so thats what CFS means :-D
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Ive been told that the tender has gone out for the conversions :wink:
I hadn't heard anything re the conversions, so you may well be right!! :-)
Pip
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BWC are getting used more and more due to no water in rural area's,they can also be used for any other type of firefighting(hazmat/structural) it does not matter if its 7000 or 26,000lts its better than not having any water at all.would be nice to see more BWC here in the southeast that CFS own rather than use council BWC at a cost.Some groups down here have to pay for the use of council BWC and others dont....
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BWC are getting used more and more due to no water in rural area's,they can also be used for any other type of firefighting(hazmat/structural) it does not matter if its 7000 or 26,000lts its better than not having any water at all.would be nice to see more BWC here in the southeast that CFS own rather than use council BWC at a cost.Some groups down here have to pay for the use of council BWC and others dont....
You mean the council are'nt donating it out of the goodness of their hearts :?
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In the Gambier,Wattle Range and Port Mac groups when ever theres a large grass or plantation fire some of the local logging companies and the councils donate their tankers to assist with water carting and not to forget the Milky tankers as well help out as well :-)
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not sure where they will put it may be in the new compton station.....
mmmmmmm .. 2 trucks in a single bay station?
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Robert wattle range have to pay for the council tankers.........and any other tankers they use......
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Guess thats one of the downsides of ESL, however that is disgraceful.
The community spirit is just not as strong as it used to be :-(
cheers
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In the Barossa, the local Groups have been very active in organising local companies to provide 31,000 litre tankers, within very short time frames, and I believe at no cost to the CFS....so some community spirit still exists!!
Pip
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I'm not sure about water tankers, but here I'm on good terms with the local mayor and we get pretty much what we want e.g they sent a front end loader out for a couple of trees down - nil cost. And when we had a few problems with flash flooding he was right on it. So I guess it is duration of the task etc.
I remember at the Winkie Case fire several years ago there were tankers from council & contractors + a five tonne front end loader. Iguess that is the other problem too - councils tend to contract out now so they may not have the equipment. And Monash CFS & Renmark MFS both have BWC's so we are pretty right for bulk water. cheers Pip
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In the Barossa, the local Groups have been very active in organising local companies to provide 31,000 litre tankers, within very short time frames, and I believe at no cost to the CFS....so some community spirit still exists!!
Pip
At Robertstown Fire the other summer, there were 3 or 4 Booths wine tankers to reload from by day 2. Unfortunately, it was very diluted & didn't taste nice. ;-)
cheers
AJ
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yes- maccy cfs does have the new BWC, it was at the recent group xmas party, for ppl to look at.
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Have Macclesfield CFS got a new BWC ?
Great :roll: brigades & grps who have tankers are getting them replaced while needy grps who don't have them continue to go without maybe we should be writing to santa claus :lol:
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Has your group asked for a BWC??
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Has your group asked for a BWC??
Since 1984 when one of our brigades had a station built to accomodate one.
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I'm not sure about water tankers, but here I'm on good terms with the local mayor and we get pretty much what we want e.g they sent a front end loader out for a couple of trees down - nil cost. And when we had a few problems with flash flooding he was right on it. So I guess it is duration of the task etc.
I remember at the Winkie Case fire several years ago there were tankers from council & contractors + a five tonne front end loader. Iguess that is the other problem too - councils tend to contract out now so they may not have the equipment. And Monash CFS & Renmark MFS both have BWC's so we are pretty right for bulk water. cheers Pip
Nah sorry chook its not Monash CFS BW7 it belongs to Chaffey Group but again there Group Base is not big enough to fit all there stuff so that why the old GO stored it at Monash. Thats what I have heard, and to make it even stranger the BW7 is not 4 wheel drive so where they need it most it will not go. It can not go to far off road.
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It is unusual to have a 4x4 tanker as you would probably have stability issues. Far better to send the 4x4 appliances out to an area where the tankers can be situated fro refilling appliances.
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Yep I know all about BW7, and yep the GO would not store it at Hughes st (space was not the issue :wink:). Sorry its stored at Monash & they drive it so I forgot it belongs to the whole of Chaffey :-D
You can get all wheel drive tankers - the army had Mack 6x6 tankers no stability issues, however the Unimog 4x4 trial tankers were a shocker :-D (chained old F1 International bulk refueling equipment to them but the spring were to soft).
I don't think the Japanese chassis would carry a decent load cross country - need to be American special build
Anyway cheers
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Belair Tanker has no problems being driven off road with the right driver. Goes most places in the Belair National Park once you lock in the rear axles. The Allison Gear Box has a brilliant low ratio.
Southern Fleurieu Group Tanker (RFW) will go anywhere a 24 will (height dependent) however has some limitations due to the tipper. Would be a great tanker if you were to take the tipper off, add a 500gpm PTO and 15000ltr tank!
I think there is a place for an off road capable BWC in a lot of areas, particularly during long hoseline running in hilly country.
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sarge i know what your talking about there was one all set to go your way but it was squashed higher up the chain like a lot of things
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Belair Tanker has no problems being driven off road with the right driver. Goes most places in the Belair National Park once you lock in the rear axles. The Allison Gear Box has a brilliant low ratio.
Southern Fleurieu Group Tanker (RFW) will go anywhere a 24 will (height dependent) however has some limitations due to the tipper. Would be a great tanker if you were to take the tipper off, add a 500gpm PTO and 15000ltr tank!
I think there is a place for an off road capable BWC in a lot of areas, particularly during long hoseline running in hilly country.
What about sand hills that are around?
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Have you seen the tyres and footprint of a 6x6 RFW?
That Tanker has been most places around Mount Compass in very sandy environments. Not any huge sand dunes, but wouldn't take any hino 24 any further than what that appliance could go!
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sarge i know what your talking about there was one all set to go your way but it was squashed higher up the chain like a lot of things
Why am I not surprised :-)