SA Firefighter
General Discussion => Country Fire Service => Topic started by: Fire000 on December 19, 2010, 07:16:53 PM
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Hi all,
Just wondering if someone could bring me up to speed on the requirements for a CFS member to drive a CFS appliances on the fireground.
Obviously there is the requirement to have the appropriate license class (MR, HR, etc), and i was under the impression the Captain had the final say in terms of approving a certain member for driving X vehicle under X priority during either day and/ore night conditions.
Someone mentioned to me that it's now a CFS requirement for members to have completed the 'Drive Vehicles Under Operational Conditions' course to be able to drive on the fireground.
Could someone please give me some info on what this course involves (does it replace the 'drive offroad course') and is it a requirement to to drive a CFS appliances on the fireground? Pip, as a Captain, perhaps you might have an insight into this.
If it is a requirement, i wonder how the remote Brigades get the truck out the door - i can't see 400+ Brigades having been training in it since its introduction.
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As far as i am aware the official CFS line is you have the correct licence go for it!! But on other hand im sure some brigades have some sort of driving program you must complete first.
The DVUOC (Drive vehicles under operational conditions) course has replaced the SORDT (Safe off road driving Techniques) course and has a component on driving the truck/command car on road. Its not a requirement at this stage to complete this before driving an apliance or command car on fire ground.
Hope this helps im sure others will have more to add :-)
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Some brigade Captains will approve all P1/P2 drivers after a period of holding a truck licence and they will then encourage you to go on and do the driver course which CFS have on offer. I would hope that the days of getting your truck licence one day and driving P1 the same day are long gone,But I am sure that some brigades still allow it.
I know of one brigade who make their new drivers wait 6months before they can drive P1 and that works well for them and the group....
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captain has to authorise and sight the licenses of any drivers of any of cfs fleet vehicle.
They decide who can drive what and when.
Provision/Probational License holders can't respond P1
Until there is enough funding for the responding in a emergency courses, I doubt they can make it a requirement for all drivers as a must have
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And just for the record just because you have a car licence does not mean you can driver a MR appliance to jobs when there is no driver at your brigade...Some brigade's are under the impression that you can...Sorry but WRONG....
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COSO 7
No requirements other than a licence appropriate to the vehicle type; ie C, MR or HR.
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Its a wonder we haven't written off more appliances !
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There is no legislated requirement for any ESO to train their drivers.
There is however a duty of care and insurance implications by not providing driver training.....with the latter having the potential to allow for significant savings in Premiums should training be provided.
As SAAS has recently discovered......lots of crashes = lots of cash lost to insurance companies!
....and the majority of this is because of stupid driver behaviors......... filtered Gen Y's!!
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Provision/Probational License holders can't respond P1
Thank god they finally changed this. Under the old COSO, with P plates you could drive a truck P1 but not a vehicle under 4.5t... go figure.
As SAAS has recently discovered......lots of crashes = lots of cash lost to insurance companies!
....and the majority of this is because of stupid driver behaviors......... filtered Gen Y's!!
I'm going to go ahead and chalk this up to the "Run silent, run deep" mentality that seems to afflict 99% of SAAS drivers. Running under lights until you get to an intersection/traffic and then firing up the sirens as you move INTO the hazard is NOT how you drive an emergency vehicle.
I guess it all comes down to how we teach the basics. Too many people use the Fire Truck as they would a car. Sticking to the left hand lane, squeezing between the footpath and traffic in the middle/left lanes.
Its not hard. It's a big truck. Drive in the far right lane. Get over early into oncoming lanes. Make noise. Stop at red lights/stop signs. Use as much of the road as possible.
At the end of the day, drive to your abilities and just because you're going under P1 conditions, doesn't mean your 12t bullet can handle any better than any other truck on the road.
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I'm going to go ahead and chalk this up to the "Run silent, run deep" mentality that seems to afflict 99% of SAAS drivers. Running under lights until you get to an intersection/traffic and then firing up the sirens as you move INTO the hazard is NOT how you drive an emergency vehicle.
And I'm going to chalk that mentality up to management. 10 years ago we had F-250's with thumping great sirens which could be heard from Ceduna in Mt Gambier
Along comes a new generation of Mercedes and some manager decided that 200 watts of siren was too much so just fitted 2x 50watt speakers to each car.
.....and then they wonder why people don't use them appropriately.
(like most married men.....when you talk and no-one listens...eventually you just stop talking!)
It's only in the last 2 years that someone woke up and decided that 200 watts of siren is more effective and has started putting it back on......and now we're starting to see another attitude change in siren use!
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Boredy....the other problem is that not too many get out of your way when the SAAS crews have the onscene lights running instead of travel when on Cat A or B, no flashing headlights makes it even harder :wink:
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The new managers cars you can hear from a 100 miles away, the normal ambulance you can't hear until its on you.
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The new managers cars you can hear from a 100 miles away, the normal ambulance you can't hear until its on you.
Hi Pumprescue, do you mean the sprint cars you can hear from 100 miles away?
Not sure if everyone's seen the youtube video here, where would we be without Keith Conlon. Gotta love the description of "hi tech flashing LED lights"
SA Ambulance Service SPRINT Animation (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNXLNsFWSjo#ws)
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Boredy....the other problem is that not too many get out of your way when the SAAS crews have the onscene lights running instead of travel when on Cat A or B, no flashing headlights makes it even harder :wink:
...and at this point is probably worth mentioning that the large majority of SAAS fleet crashes occur at very low speed, not on an urgent case and usually in reverse!
Oh and the stupid numpty, not on a case- who took off when the light turned green...directly into the back of the car in front which hadn't seen the green.....
...oh and the stupid numpty who put one on it's side in a suburban street......."turning a corner and hit an oil patch"
Anyone detecting a sarcastically disturbing trend here??
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To be a driver is being a stupid numpty a job requirement, or is just listed as desirable?
Thought I might try out.....though I could be over qualified!...Oh well, theres always SES!
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Not to mention the kangaroo that KO'd MV71 the other morning...ouch!!!
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Or a near miss a few days ago....ambo turning left at an intersection....into the path of a BRT going lights & sirens to the same job.......!
Pip
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Bring back LTS sirens on fire trucks.....
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Bring back LTS sirens on fire trucks.....
I'm sure Andy wouldn't complain about that :-D
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The new managers cars you can hear from a 100 miles away, the normal ambulance you can't hear until its on you.
and trust me, you don't want to be standing next to a SPRINT car when it takes off to a Cat A/B case, it's quite piercing and even painful
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Some brigade Captains will approve all P1/P2 drivers after a period of holding a truck licence and they will then encourage you to go on and do the driver course which CFS have on offer. I would hope that the days of getting your truck licence one day and driving P1 the same day are long gone,But I am sure that some brigades still allow it.
I know of one brigade who make their new drivers wait 6months before they can drive P1 and that works well for them and the group....
Again thats all well and good for brigades with driver\members coming out of the woodwork but not for brigades struggling with numbers.
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Gotta go with competency...some people will hold a licence for years, and still not be able to drive, while others will get a licence, and prove to be a capable driver in a month........
Pip
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I've got 6 drivers who want to do DVUOC course however funding cuts have now meerley registered their interest