SA Firefighter
General Discussion => SA Firefighter General => Topic started by: Scania_1 on July 22, 2006, 09:42:35 AM
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Interested to hear peoples opinion on what jobs SES/CFS should or shouldnt be attending. Like retrieving bogged vehicles and broken down cars. These are jobs for the RAA and tow trucks. Emergency services are for emergencies are they not? Not for people who dont want to spend money..
eg 191201 03:57:55 16-07-06 FLEX-A ALPHA 1600 MFS: RESPOND To 16/07/06 03:54,BURRA SES,BURRA, MAP 0 A 0 ,,WOMAN, VEHICLE & TRAILER STRANDED 20KM OUT OF BURRA ON MORGAN RD. UNABLE TO GET TOW TRUCK TO ASSIST. CONTACT MFS COMMS,75129*CFSRES:
-= SES Burra response =-
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yea i think there should be some guidelines on this, there are some things you just wonder. but remember pager messages don't always say what it is, she could have been stuck in her car in some water or something, so you never know without the details.
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call out is a call out, good way to pass some time when youre sitting on your donkey with nothing else to do. Or when you get asked to do something, just hoping that pager is going to go off.... :-P :mrgreen:
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I know that the SES refer some of the tree jobs they go to , to Mr Clip as they are not emergencies. Just trees that need a trim or ones they think might fall down. People shouldnt take advantage of emergency services thats all. Like getting towed out when bogged cause they dont want to pay a tow truck etc.
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Time the public paid for all these bogged cars,RAA Will charge so why don't we??? But then again people would say that is way we pay a emergency service fee
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We do not mind going to these types of call outs. It usually because someone is in trouble and needs help. They are always embarrassed about it,so give them a brake. :roll:
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What a kit kat break :roll:
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I would prefer the old Tosca bar thanks :-D
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i agree with backburn. Personally, I don't care at all what we jobs we do. I feel that if a person is in a time of need, we're there to help.
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Some Units have been to so many 'young adults in 4wd getting bogged at night' that they are refusing to risk the vehicles and equipment. Many kilometers into a national park near a major country city).
But other Units (near country beaches) will do the job because it is a risk to property, like a house.
The best incident was 5 young adults stuck in a bogged vehicle in a national/conservation park they were not allowed in. This was on a stormy wet night.
I THINK the Unit responded to collect the people and transport them to the township to prevent hypothermia risk because they had no bedding in the bogged vehicle.
But because it was late at night, they left the vehicle bogged. The track the vehicle was on was not used so no risk of a further MVA.
The young adults were not happy because they had to face their parents (the owner of the bogged 4wd) and arrange for the vehicle to be removed by friends the next day.
I personally think this is good, because they removed the emergency risk to life. Then the rest is not an emergency, but an inconvenience.
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Emergency services are for emergencies are they not? Not for people who dont want to spend money..
eg 191201 03:57:55 16-07-06 FLEX-A ALPHA 1600 MFS: RESPOND To 16/07/06 03:54,BURRA SES,BURRA, MAP 0 A 0 ,,WOMAN, VEHICLE & TRAILER STRANDED 20KM OUT OF BURRA ON MORGAN RD. UNABLE TO GET TOW TRUCK TO ASSIST. CONTACT MFS COMMS,75129*CFSRES:
-= SES Burra response =-
It does not say all on the pager but may be the vehicle & trailer where half on the road or in a more dangers position who knows just get out there and help ( if only no filter)
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Obviously each incident needs to be judged on its merits..
People need to be reminded that we are volunteers and do give up our time freely...BUT employers wouldn't be happy to know that you were away from work for 4hrs to retrieve a bogged vehicle..
There was an issue on the weekend...landowner buring old hay and loppings...creating much smoke near township...some complained..SAPOL were going to call us to extinguish..under these circumstances, we have no right to extinguish, it wasn't threatening property or out of control..
Sometimes it's our efficiency and abilities that get us jobs..and it doesn't look good to say ..sorry not in our j&p's .. :evil:
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Obviously each incident needs to be judged on its merits..
People need to be reminded that we are volunteers and do give up our time freely...BUT employers wouldn't be happy to know that you were away from work for 4hrs to retrieve a bogged vehicle..
There was an issue on the weekend...landowner buring old hay and loppings...creating much smoke near township...some complained..SAPOL were going to call us to extinguish..under these circumstances, we have no right to extinguish, it wasn't threatening property or out of control..
Sometimes it's our efficiency and abilities that get us jobs..and it doesn't look good to say ..sorry not in our j&p's .. :evil:
I thought you were able to extinguish if the burn posed a threat to public safety (in this case smoke drifting over roads and lowering vision), but i suppose the decision to extinguish is taken job by job.
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The smoke was not creating any visibility issues..just some neighbours being painful.. :evil:
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oh fair enough
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For starters CFS are NOT allowed to tow vehicles with their appliances according to a new COSO and if something gets damaged when you are the CFS is not liable.
Are we honestly going to be another RAA, when these calls come in the operations centres should be directing the calls elsewhere.
Honestly people is it really worth getting out of bed at 3 in the morning to go and get some person that has bogged themselves out of the POO when it could be done by a tow truck, when life is in danger yes i agree, but in a normal sitaution NO.
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For starters CFS are NOT allowed to tow vehicles with their appliances according to a new COSO and if something gets damaged when you are the CFS is not liable.
I'm an idiot :d
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I would expect that each situation is judged on it's merits..eg if it's a life threatening situation or if Burnside Car1 was at risk of being lost...tow it..
We had lengthy discussions about some appliances wanting tow chains..now this I am totally opposed to ...snatch strap yes, chain...absolutely NOT!.. imagine the OHS if a chain whipped and collected some :-o
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Not much different different damage to the body I would say snatch strap has a whip thing going as a chain would fling back same speed, they both would hurt.
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I think the issue with Burnside Car 1 was that it was sinking, with crew on board, and the group control centre wouldn't respond any help to them because they said CFS trucks weren't allowed to tow... We can tell the service has turned to S*^*7 when we're not even allowed to rescue our fellow firefighters.. :(
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I think the issue with Burnside Car 1 was that it was sinking, with crew on board, and the group control centre wouldn't respond any help to them because they said CFS trucks weren't allowed to tow... We can tell the service has turned to S*^*7 when we're not even allowed to rescue our fellow firefighters.. :(
2 points:
1) the group base does not make the decisions just passes them on from the incident controller / operations officer.
2) that incident with burnside car 1 during the floods was a little more complicated than has been written here, there were good reasons why that decision that was made (obviously!).
regarding towing, I think some of you need to read the rules a bit more carefully, it doesn't say "no towing" fullstop. Towing someone's private car with an appliance is a lot more dodgy than towing another appliance on the fireground, for example.
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Roger, Darius...
I haven't seen the rules... Are we allowed to 'tow' a vehicle with a winch attached to a CFS vehicle?
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Its a Grey area like alot of the SOPS,and what you think it says someone else say the other....
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I thought you were able to extinguish if the burn posed a threat to public safety (in this case smoke drifting over roads and lowering vision), but i suppose the decision to extinguish is taken job by job.
we have no authority to extinguish a burn outside of the fire season, unless SAPOL have investigated and have requested we do so.
btw; what was the situation with B car 1?
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I was told we could extinguish fires in non fire seasons if they have things in there that are not to be burnt. Like treated pine, plastic, tyres ect
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i guess that depends on whether its 'out of control'...
but out act only gives us power to act against the residents wishes, without police involvement, inside the fire season...
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What about if you get called out by the Council Fire prevention Officer or the EPA
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well then you have there authorisation... and they do have the power to enforce the fires extinguishment.... but id wanna make sure i either had them on scene or had it in writing
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We normaly have them on scene as we get quite a few calls from them. As well as the police as they call them out as well.
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well then you shud be alright :wink:
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The rule about towing with CFS appliances came about because some had ripped off their bullbars etc and damaged private vehicles while doing so,as snatch straps etc were not secured in the correct location.This applies to private vehicles as CFS will not indemnify anyone who does it and causes damage to a private vehicle hence its not allowed.I have towed many a CFS vehicle out of a bog,creek crossing while on the fireground,and appliances with flat batteries due to drivers not winding the revs up at an incident when running all the revolving lights,spotlights,pump etc.
Something we should all be concerned about is NO JUMPER LEADS on appliances as standard stowage :-o
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What if your truck gets a flat battery? ...and its an automatic?
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This has happened when i was at Salisbury and we called the RAA would you believe.
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Something we should all be concerned about is NO JUMPER LEADS on appliances as standard stowage :-o
So... carry them as non standard stowage?
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All of our appliances carry them.
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Was talking to a SES guy the other day and he was saying if the stopped doing tow jobs from the beach they would have to close as they would only do 25 jobs a year as the where not RCR......
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we carry jumper leads on both trucks anyway... and although theyve never been used on the trucks, we have had to jump start group vehicles for the GOs a few times..... :roll:
LOL - weve also had issues with our battery isolaters a few times in the past... i can remember rocking up to the station a few times, and once we got a few bods, having to push start the appliance through the car park... LMAO
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Yeah, we've had to jump our truck out of the station a couple of times because someone has left the isolating switch on...unfortunately, there is an incline once you get out of the shed..hard to push :x
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Don't you leave your trucks plugged in to trickle chargers? Or don't they work if the truck isn't isolated?
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they are plugged in, but i believe the radios and radio chargers (which turn on when the battery is unisolated, draw more power than the trickle charge trickles...
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ahh, ok... That would have made for some quite amusing photos :D
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Its all downhill from the doors for us... It helps!
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1928011 19:13:33 13-08-06 MFS: RESPOND RESCUE GENERAL 13/08/06 19:11,GOOLWA CFS,GOOLWA, MAP 0 0 0 ,,FROM SAPOL ASSIST 4WD BOGGED MURRAY MOUTH. ENTERED FROM GOOLWA BEACH. P3.,73229*CFSRES:
An all too common happening down here :roll:
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1928011 19:13:33 13-08-06 MFS: RESPOND RESCUE GENERAL 13/08/06 19:11,GOOLWA CFS,GOOLWA, MAP 0 0 0 ,,FROM SAPOL ASSIST 4WD BOGGED MURRAY MOUTH. ENTERED FROM GOOLWA BEACH. P3.,73229*CFSRES:
An all too common happening down here :roll:
what confuses me here is why does the page say goolwa CFS, goolwa when the station number at the end is an SES station no.?
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Possibly that is where the caller is going to meet them....I agree re CFS/SES on the page confusing :|
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Ha good luck to the SES last couple of times this has happened they didn't want to know about the job. And it is a little soft down there at the moment to even consider trying to pull them out. Honestly i don't think this should be even contemplated as a job is it really worth the risk of getting an emergency vehicle bogged trying to get out some inexperinced f**kwit who shouldn't be driving where they are.
[Mod edit: censoring language]
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agreed. loving the imperfect filter firefrog! booyah! :-D
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Cheers Firey kinda forgot to check that :oops: :lol:
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Ha good luck to the SES last couple of times this has happened they didn't want to know about the job. And it is a little soft down there at the moment to even consider trying to pull them out. Honestly i don't think this should be even contemplated as a job is it really worth the risk of getting an emergency vehicle bogged trying to get out some inexperinced f**kwit who shouldn't be driving where they are.
[Mod edit: censoring language]
What emergency vehicle?
You don't mean the orange tow truck do you?
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:lol: :lol:. Plus it helps get your call rate up when the local copper is an active member in their unit. The amount of jobs they get called to in Goolwa that they aren't needed for is ridiculous.
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re; GOOLWA CFS, GOOLWA - i believe if MFS dont have the location in theredatabase it is the easiest thing for them to do, as they may have that location as a referance...
if that makes sense.
re; removing vehicles - does this come down to protecting life and property ??? personally i think the person is an idiot, and should know how to get themselves out, but still.... soemthing worth considering :?
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The reason SES/CFS get these calls is because a standard tow fee callout is $250.00 plus running kms depot to depot.After being told that on the phone its no wonder we get called to help because its free :?
Life or property threat..possibility but honestly there are some STUPID people out there who think their cars are Unimogs and can go anywhere :evil:
I saw a page for a SE unit a while back and the page said car and boat off ramp...DOH!
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Had a look at the NEW SES station that is under construction at Millicent very nice but a waste of tax payers money.The SES there do more beach tows than anything else and the cfs at MIllicent could done with a new station rather than a shed that will house a free public towing service.....draw the line in the sand and start to charge a fee...
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How about just co-locating the 2 services...... both get nice shiny new facilities then :)
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Worked in Renmark :wink:
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In Renmark its SES and MFS, not SES and CFS
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Still co located eh :-D