station numbers again

[corocfs]

this was discused in a thread a wee while ago somewhere...
here are station numbers for fire stations in south australia.

these station numbers exist for brigades that occasionally (or all the time) get dispatched by SAMFS, as it is aprt of there CAD system i believe... all of these numbers 'part-one' are followed by a 'part-two' as i will call it..

part-one = station / part-two = type of appliance SAMFS is dispatching

this is why there are often differances in brigade numberings at end of pager messages

eg: eden hills may have 4619 (pump rescue reponse), or 4628 (hazmat response) other brigades will get other variations, ending in 42's (tanker) 24's (2000L 4wd grass) 32's (3000L 2wd grass)34's (3000L 4WD grass)etc.. depending on what vehicle there station houses. another commone one is an 8 (4WD pump) although i am not sure of the accuracy concerning the 8', as i dont believe the CFS has any 4WD pumpers.

stations with an (m) are SAMFS stations:

(M)ADELAIDE 20
(M)GLYNDE 22
(M)WOODVILLE 24
(M)PT ADELAIDE 25
(M)MARINE STN 27
(M)LARGS NORTH 28
BURNSIDE 29
(M)OAKDEN 30
(M)GOLDEN GROVE 31
(M)SALISBURY 32
(M)ELIZABETH 33
(M)GAWLER 35
(M)ANGLE PARK 36
(M)PROSPECT 37
(M)ST MARYS 40
(M)CAMDEN PARK 41
(M)OHALLORAN HILL 42
(M)CHRISTIES DOWNS 43
(M)GLEN OSMOND 44
(M)BROOKLYN PARK 45
EDEN HILLS 46
BLACKWOOD 47
BELAIR 48
COROMANDEL VALLEY 49
(M)PT PIRIE 50
(M)PT AUGUSTA 51
(M)WHYALLA 52
(M)PT LINCOLN 54
(M)PETERBOROUGH 55
(M)BURRA 56
CHERRY GARDENS 57
(M)BERRI 60
(M)RENMARK 61
(M)LOXTON 62
(M)TANUNDA 63
(M)KAPUNDA 64
(M)KADINA 66
(M)WALLAROO 67
(M)MOONTA 68
(M)MT GAMBIER 70
(M)VICTOR HARBOUR 71
(M)MURRAY BRIDGE 72
NORTON SUMMIT/ASHTON 74
PICCADILLY 75
HAPPY VALLEY 80
MORPHETT VALE 81
SEAFORD 83
UPPER STURT 84
IRONBANK 85
BRADBURY 86
MYLOR 87
BRIDGEWATER 88
STIRLING 90
SALISBURY 91
DALKIETH 92
ROSEWORTHY 93
ATHELSTONE 94
TEA TREE GULLY 95
VIRGINIA 96
ONE TREE HILL 97
CAREY GULLY 104
CLARENDON 114
KANGARILLA 117
HAHNDORF 122
MACCLESFIELD 124
MEADOWS 125
MT BARKER 127
BRUKUNGA 128
NAIRNE 129
BLEWITT SPRINGS 131
BALHANNAH 135
WOODSIDE 137
BLACKFELLOWS CREEK 151
ASHBOURNE 156
WOODCHESTER 157
ALDINGA BEACH 162
MCLAREN VALE 163
CALLINGTON 361

as far as i am aware these are the only stations SMAFS are able to respond by pager, if they recieve a call for another brigades area the reponse would be organsied through CFS SHQ or on the brigades alerts.

just thought i would try to put up someinfo i had recently gathered, considering we had a discussion on the topic that went round and round a long time ago...

i am putting together this info purely for my own interest, please feel free to disagree with me or give me any other info you may have... if you have anything you could contribute please post here or PM me.

[CFS_Firey]

although i am not sure of the accuracy concerning the 8', as i don't believe the CFS has any 4WD pumpers.

Wouldn't a 24P or 34P constitute a 4WD pumper?

Thanks for the info firetruck - I have personally never seen our brigade have anything  except 19, (pump rescue), responded, do you get that often, or are you just explaining what might happen?

Another interesting thing to note, is that SOC aren't allowed to respond brigades that are primarily responded by MFS unless the call comes from a CFS source, (like backup is requested from another brigade). In other circumstances, they have to ring MFS to get those brigades responded... Seems like a waste of time and resources to me, but there must be a good reason, after all this is the CFS

[strikeathird]

The code is the same for your brigade, no matter what the response.  Thus why the 19.  It will not change depending on the job, meaning if you get a grass fire it will not change the code, you will stil lget 19.

That is what is in the SAMFS data base, so that is what it will always say...  No matter what the job is, or no matter what appliance you should be taking.

[24P]

99% of the time we will get a 19 on the end of the page from MFS eg 9119, but on the odd occasion we will get a 9124 (even though we dont have a 24) or a 9142. I think it just depends on whos on and if they feel like changing it. A few more Brigades that MFS comms page are Two Wells = 22224, Kadina = 28819 and Bordertown, Starts with 58 - cant remember the rest

[TillerMan]

9119 should be your regular turnout code but 9124 and 9142 will be when you are requested specificly for your rural appliance or for your tanker.

[corocfs]

19 would be a turnout for most regular responses... only brigades that carry rescue gear should get this code, and it will be on all there pages for responses to VAs.

you will only se codes such as 28 or 42 if the brigade is being responded to a specific incident...

i will use eden hills as an example again..
most often they will get 4619 (standard response eden pumper), but if they are responded to a hazmat it will be 4628 (HAZMAT response eden pumper) same truck diff code.
belair on the other hand would normally get responded by 4819, but may get 4842 if they are being requested purely for the tanker (another group/brigade response area perhaps)

[TillerMan]

The biggest problem with the numbering is they have taken the old system and added to it and modified it.

Salisbury would have used to be 919  (station 91 pump rescue) for their 24p, 918 (station 91 rural appliance large) for their 34 and 9142 (station 91 tanker) for their tanker.

Now its a mixture of the station code and appliance code and doesn't really mean anything except a number in the data base for area and paging purposes. Technically now were supposed to called adelaide fire by our proper call signs eg. salisbury 24p.

[corocfs]

The code is the same for your brigade, no matter what the response.  Thus why the 19. 

not true... if your satation only houses one type of appliance and doesnt specialise... it will stay same, however you wud get diff. codes for either HAZMAT or tanker request

[TillerMan]

Yes, even kangarilla gets responded differently for the tanker than the normal 34 or 24.

[oz fire]

Another interesting thing to note, is that SOC aren't allowed to respond brigades that are primarily responded by MFS unless the call comes from a CFS source, (like backup is requested from another brigade). In other circumstances, they have to ring MFS to get those brigades responded... Seems like a waste of time and resources to me, but there must be a good reason, after all this is the CFS

This wasn't driven by CFS - it was driven by a couple of the groups who have used MFS for some time. Initially a particular DGO caused no amount of grief several years ago when the SOC responded several brigades from his group, folowing a request directly from a reliable source (CFS member on scene and on radio). From here several other groups adopted the same stance and informed the SOC that they were not to page the brigades/groups direct as they had systems in place with MFS..... go figure.

Interesting to note - the same group started relying on a commercial paging provider and rejected the offer from CFS to undertake the role during the transition to mfs!!!!

[Wagon 1]

But CFS don't have the B**ls to tell these groups how it is, give SOC the info and it wouldn't matter, it might be me being cynical, but does it have anything to do with red truck wannabes in some of these groups, and also the fact that some work for them. If you ask me, sometimes I think we get a better service from SOC, for the equipment they have, if you ever get the chance, take a tour of SOC, it opens your eyes to what they have to work with compared to SAMFS comms!!

Also, in regards to the numbering, someone hit it one the head, they have taken the old numbers and added to it, for the original EMA brigades, the numbers still mean something, for the newer brigades, it means nothing.

[corocfs]

state needs to tell the regions to tell the groups to get in line... avoid all thr BS that occurs.

its ridiculous... a call comes to SOC, so they hang up and pass the details onto MFS who respond the brigade, who then talk to SOC anyway!!!!

[Roger]

This wouldn't be an issssue if the CRD (CFS-SOC & MFS) were in the same room...it's coming...Yes, it is ridiculous and, IMHO, the double handling of calls causes undue delays that may put the public at risk... Bring on the one call centre!

Brigade numbers (the 2nd part) will depend on the resource that the MFS computer needs to find. The Salisbury (et al) change from 919 to 9119 was initially done to accommodate the customisation on the MFS BOMS, so that in dual response areas the computer was told that it had to recommend a type 19 appliance, whereas b4 it would recommend the apps in numerical order (where 321 & 329 are lower than 919..) You have to admit that there have been fewer of those old "we got left out" probs since. The other resources such as 42, 28 etc means that a resource can be located even if it is way down the list of nearest brigades...but it might still be the nearest resource of that type. Heysen Lofty & Sturt groups use this very well to respond the nearest rescue, tanker or hazmat to jobs from the first dispatch.

[oz fire]

But CFS don't have the B**ls to tell these groups how it is,

I could not agree more. Although not up to the SOC to tell them, it would be nice to see some RC's and the CEO, DCO pull Groups back into line. We are meant to be a service, with standards, policies and procedures - the problem is people don't want to offend others and are scared of the backlash - it would be nice to see the service brass grow some balls!!!

As for the numbers for the more remote stations - SAMFS has always had numbers for most CFS stations across the state - they used this to reference them as SAMFS Commcen takes specific calls on behalf of both fire services and has for years as they are the only ones with the equipment.

The sooner we have a state wide CRD centre, the better - for all services!! Not just fire and rescue, but medical as well

[Wagon 1]

Well, I will beleive it when I see it!! 

By the way, have you ever seen a pager message from SAMFS comms to a station who's area isn't in a UBD, my god its a disgrace, bet the likes of STURT, HEYSEN and MT LOFTY wouldn't put up with that.
If you know someone with a decoder have a look sometimes, its terrible, most often it doesn't tell them anything at all MFS RESPOND BORDERTOWN CFS, BORDERTOWN, MAP 0.0, 5419 or whatever, I wouldn't put up with that. Which brings me a question, does CFS have a service agreement with SAMFS for response paging? If they do then I would like to see what it is.

[Toast]

We still get the nothing messages occasionally "MFS: Respond RCR Stirling cfs, Strling, Map0,0 9019" I was told as a new member not to interrogate the pager but to use it as a "Hey, help is needed come to station for details" message.

In terms of who pages who, doesnt a 000 call goto adelaide fire (MFS commcen) who then turn out CFS, whereas a call to SOC will have CFS SOC turn out CFS?

Is this the way it works, or have I missed something?

[TillerMan]

Toast the problem the other guys are talking about is some groups don't want cfs paging them at all even if it comes via thier alerts.

[Toast]

Bah, thats crazy. It shouldn't matter CFS or MFS turning us out, as long as it happens

[TillerMan]

These groups think they have special response methods with mfs but i dont see why they cant set this up with cfs.

[Roger]

When these groups set up their direct page facilities the CFS didn't have the ability to follow group response plans on a street-by-street and incident type-by-incident type basis. The MFS offered a service that allowed for local response plans, multiple brigade/service simultaneous dispatch, and what's more, a consistent response to like incidents. In some areas, not far south of the city, one person answers the alerts phone and, rather than follow predetermined response plans, will decide off the top of his head who should respond. This is doomed by subjective decisions that will work sometimes, and be way off the scale other times. Even now, as far as I am aware, the CFS doesn't have a decent CAD database to say that this group wants this, and that group wants that for x type of call...

[Wagon 1]

That is true roger, whilst we still have volunteers on the phone you will continue to get some rather interesting response requests. I have questioned some responses from SOC only to find out that the response was done at the request of a briigade member on the Alerts call.

[Robert-Robert34]

What ever happened to the fire phone system i am aware it was decommissioned because running costs but it's alot more better than getting paged by 2 communication centres up in Adelaide for the same incident

Serveral years ago before paging was deemed fashionable by CFS the Kalangadoo brigade had a fire phone number which was 393000,whenever a fire or accident was reported to this station number the call would go to any of the brigade phones and whoever answered would press a button and our station siren would go off automatically ensuring a full crew turnout nearly 100% of the time

As for being paged by MFS or SOC for the same incident is very confusing. Whereas before SAAS communications centre in Mount Gambier was shutdown any fire calls that came through 000 requiring Kalangadoo 34's response were directed to SE Comms as it was known and the SAAS communcations officer in Mount Gambier would page us in the quickest amount of time

[strikeathird]

I know of a number of brigades which still operate a Fire Phone.

[Stefan KIRKMOE]

SAMFS Comms is the backup to SOC. If SOC fails to answer a call in a specific time limit the call will divert to SAMFS Comms, if the Telstra  000 operators decide it's taking too long to answer the call they may also divert straight to SAMFS. Thus because of the  backup SAMFS Comms have the ability one way or another to respond all CFS brigades from memory, not just MA or EMA brigades. The 'BOMS' system SAMFS use for response changed a number of months back, very similar but different response types or classes. Until both comms decide to work together then there will always be in-differences. A but like the fact SOC does most SES responses....At the end of the day as long as the public get a response!

[Wagon 1]

The "fire phone" still exists but its called Alerts. You can still set the siren off but it has to be done from SOC, all you need to do is ask for URGMSG in your pager message instead of CFSRES. I think times have moved on from the press the button system, I know some people used it selectivley!!