Mount Barker Pumper

[Good times]

Yeah, it reversed into the station overnight , then drove out again the next day!!  The SAMFS Volvo is still front runner.

[fire03rescue]

Second hand problems
Mt Barker should have a new appliance

I would love to see the MFS get a used appliance, they union would put up a big fight

[Good times]

Yes, we asked vfba and were told that we should take that back through the group, read between the lines is we don't want to rock the boat coz cfs fund us.

[Mike]

Personally I dont have a problem with second hand appliances..... as long as they are up to the standard, in good condition... and working properly!

I believe MFS have a rolling turn over where the high turnout stations get vehicles replaced quite frequntly, and outer stations recieve hand-me-downs from there. An idea which i have no problem with if the brigade recieving is low turnout, and the vehicle is in good nic.....

The catch question is 'why was the vehicle made second hand in the first place?'

[JamesGar]

Mick, not sure as to why the vehicles are second hand in the first place, but I have heard that there was some industrial dispute/ union ban about the Dennis leaving the UK in the first place.

I believe there is a number of blown valves on the pump currently and some engine problems.

I've heard that the MFS Tech Service guy really like the appliance and rate it very highly. With the MFS like all fire services having a strong traditional bond I'm not surprise, as the then SA Fire Service (SAFS) in the 1970 ran Dennis appliances as front line truck, with an interesting front/bull bar mounted PTO pump???

I'd take one if one was offer as a replacement to our pumper instead of the 34P that I believe we're getting!

As for appliance movements I've got no problem with changing vehicle on workload issue. This is something that SAAS has looked at. Big problem is that stations with the higher workload tend to mistreat the vehicles, hard driving, hard treatment, and this tends to develop premature engine and ergonomic problems.

[strikeathird]

I think the Denis became second hand in the first place, because, as like SAMFS, they turn there trucks round every few years...

I agree, i would take it any day... (As long as the couple problems are fixed, i think she would be a pearler of a rig!!

[Good times]

The Dennis was purchased second hand because the Brits have a policy to have no front line trucks older than 10 years, so there is a heap of pumpers that are just over 10 years old doing nothing, the Dennis is the Rolls Royce of fire trucks so once all the bugs are sorted its going to be a ripper of a truck to have. New Zealand Fire Service have nearly 40 of these on the run and they love them!

James, SAMFS have not used Dennis since the early 50's, the appliance your thinking of is the Chubb Pacesetter with front mount pump, SAMFS (SAFB not SAFS) had 5 of these, less than 10 were ever built worldwide, very good truck but to radical a design for most.

SAMFS are also not sending as many second hand trucks out to the country, you look at most SAMFS retained now and they are getting new trucks, perhaps the second away might be older but most first away are new.


Also James I would rather a Dennis than a 34P too, and I hope Belair don't roll over and accept the 34P, it would be a big step down from your current appliance!!!

[JamesGar]

Thanks GT for the correction, I did know that SAFB/MFS had used Dennis appliances, just wasn't 100% sure of when.

I think a welcome to new member Jason who appears to be from Mt Barker so we should be able to get more of a regular update on Dennis!

As for Belair and the 34P, the brigade will definitely not lie down and accept this replacement for Pumper, there's no way we should be going backwards in capability!

I have been lead to believe that the CFS know uses Brigades 'Service Requirements' not SFEC description (which I think is the Board Approved documentation for appliances) for the desicion for appliance placements, but have not seen any documentation to prove that! I'm sure some politician would make a meal out of some of the processes that have been carried out within CFS at the moment.....

[JamesGar]

I received a PM from jason our Mt Barker member on the forum who has informed me that they had the Dennis last weekend and found around 27 faults with it in a weekend, so it's been offline being repaired this week and they hopefully will get it back tomorrow night.

Also talk to a member of our brigade who is a MFS mechanic/engineer who said the dennis would keep up, if not out do the MFS on pumping capability! Looking forward to seeing it in action!

[Good times]

Like I said the Dennis is the Rolls Royce of fire trucks, but like anything second hand there will be problems, mind you how often do our new trucks go out of service, isn't that right Stirling!!

James in regards to what you are being told about the new SFEC calculation thing, don't have the wool pulled over your eyes, we were told the same thing but have since found out that its not even progressed past the planning stage so approach it on the old way, and don't be told otherwise unless it can be produced in black and white, I get the distinct feeling we are being told this because if all SFEC's are done then some big dollars will need to be spent!!

[jason]

Hi all, FYI- Dennis arrived Thursday afternoon in Mt Barker & was back in the workshop by Thursday Night (Blew a Turbo line ) . So we may see it by next Friday after they replace all the old lines.   it’s almost a brand New truck now - The only thing left to replace is the shell....

[Good times]

Your joking, what a lemon, this has to be the most jinxed Dennis out there, I have spoken to some New Zealanders who are running heaps of this model and they never had any real issues.

[strikeathird]

What i cant understand, is how the saftey standards etc are met in the UK and NZ, but we have to change everything on it when it comes over here in Australia....

[jason]

I think the main problem with Dennis is that it has just been sitting around in yards, out in the weather, for the last five years not being driven, serviced etc.  
But now that all these mechanical fault have been fixed. Hopefully it will be a good truck to keep us going for a bit longer.

[strikeathird]

I'd take the Dennis  any day!

[CFS_Firey]

Like I said the Dennis is the Rolls Royce of fire trucks, but like anything second hand there will be problems, mind you how often do our new trucks go out of service, isn't that right Stirling!!

Actually, the new part of Stirling pumper is beautiful… Until the recent electrical problems, (Recent being that the truck is still offline) The Isuzu chassis has been excellent… The main problem, the pump, is a second hand American pump that was put in to save money (against our specifications).
My point being that our problems have been with second hand parts, not new ones…
(I’m not certain that the pump is second hand, but it was defiantly not bought for our pumper)

[Good times]

The pump wasn't  second hand , it was in stock,and cheaper, I think from speaking to some guys at Stirling that it was specced with a 2 stage pump and a "certain person" from HQ got involved and now your truck is like it is, with a useless single stage pump!!

In regards to the cab/chassis, that was Isuzu's attempt to break into the fire appliance market with the urban pumpers, you will notice it has a much higher horse power engine, 270 hp I think, auto gearbox and a raised roof crew cab for BA seats and the like. But since you got that truck they no longer produce it as it was a huge flop, as in nobody bought them, the Scania chassis is by far the most succesful.

[mattb]

Interesting to read in the Eastern Courier messenger today that Burnside are to get a new appliance this year, apparently their prototype 24 is to go to Greenhill CFS. Also mentions that negotiations are underway to replace the Pumper next year.

Any ideas on what the 24 will be replaced with ??

[Good times]

The 24 will be replaced with a 34P, the pumper is "in negotiation" in other words what is on offer is not suitable.

People, get your SFEC's up to scratch and you will be surprised what you can get!!

[Mike]

Now that the Dennis has been used in anger a few times...
Has Barkers opinion of it changed???

[24P]

Lucky them getting a choice I wonder where the dennis would have ended up if they chose the type 2?

[strikeathird]

Good call!  Keep the Dennis!!

[corocfs]

what a complete load of crap...
all the time/effort required to get Dennis here.. it seems to have been a failure (from what i have read, been told, observed) and now its getting retired so quickly...

i hope CFS never goes down this road of importing appliances again.

[JamesGar]

Alex bit quick to mow the Dennis down. This was the first time something like importing appliances has been tried for the CFS. Of course there's going to be some teething problems the first time. I think if they want to truely try this idea out to save money then it should be done on a 5 to 10 appliance trial, not just 1. It's not giving us an accurate point of view. I agree that this truck hasn't been cost effective, but I'm sure that the CFS has learnt from it's mistakes this time and if there was another dennis to come over that it would be a much smoother and cheaper operation.

I believe the Type 2 Pumper is going to replace both Mount Barkers 24P and Rescue appliance, leaving a 4 appliance brigade.

I'm also under the impression that the main problem with Dennis is the lack of Air Conditioning. Heater works very well, in fact the Pizza's at the House Fire the other night stayed very hot with the Heaters on in the cab!

[24P]

James did you mean a 3 appliance brigade? (they have 4 now)
ps any idea where the type 2 thats being built is headed?